Peter Giljevic

Rang Craig, am downloading it again now & will report back once I test it today. *fingers crossed*

Another day, another firmware/PC Link, same basic ~20 minute drive and the water/methanol tank is 1/3 drained, car runs like shit V's what I had before that was perfect on 4.4.6. Hopefully tomorrow I will get a new computer sent to me with the old firmware & my perfect tune so I can get my car up and running again the way it was. My Moral to this, don't change something until some other people trial it first..... I will send through the log and also logged it on my Race Logic VBOX for evidence/proof of which I have plenty of runs of exact same loop on 4.4.6 and my tune with no such issues. Why the Aux 1 PWM is shitting itself I do not know, and am beyond caring anymore.

New firmware and PC Link to down load see E-Mail below for others so you are aware and get the latest. I don't know if it will fix the problem I am having but will check it later today. 'I am not going to get more time to look into this today. Please download the latest PCLink and firmware that was posted on the web today. If after installing that if the problem is still there then I will spend some time looking into... Regards Ashley Duncan Engineer'

Sent you E-Mail.

I have run this system for over 4000km and its faultless, this only happened the exact day I did the firmware upgrade too.... (tested it least now I know I suppose). Some how it must be leaving the Aux 1 open! thus draining out my WI tank all the time while the motor is running rather than working off the set values I have to govern its operation. Switch conditions, logic and all settings are exactly as per what I ran in the last firmware. 100% there is a problem somewhere in how this channel works now, stuffed ECU or Firmware I don't know? Days go by and my stress level goes through the roof.

Well I found the problem and it was not me! its in the new firmware upgrade! My richness was/is due to my water methanol injection system which is run of Aux output 1 GP PWM circuit. I only found this out as my f*cking tank was empty today! after only little use, I though it had a split or faulty valve, but no such thing. I filled it up and checked the pressure all good, tested the valves off PWM1 and PWM3 (water injecting and IC spray circuits), tank level full. Thought to go for light drive 20min trip only using boost once or twice no more than 3500rpm and car ran rich back on throttle and at part cruise again! Check tank level and its used over 1/3rd!!!! This was the problem all along! the engine pinged today in 2nd gear and I only thought to check it after stuffing around all day today trying to figure out why my fuel mapping has changed on cruise and part throttle (but not idle and full power). I hope you people sort this thing out, annoyed does not describe how I feel tonight typing this out on here. I feel sorry for my poor engine and my nerves.

Hi Ash, my E-Mail is [email protected] please E-Mail me and I will send the files you requested. It happens on the PC logging, hit the record button and the software locks up as described. Any help you can give to sort that out ASAP is my #1 priority. *very urgent* For the other stuff I was talking with Jurgen over E-Mail and I think it was to do with non cleared error codes (with any firmware over 4.4.1) tip I found on the ViPEC forum. When I reset this the car is a bit better, but 100% there are some fueling differences, the master fuel trim is set to 0% too. Best Regards. Peter

Drove it today = very bad result, almost everything in the fueling has changed & gone much richer. First: Cold start = motor stalls after firing up. (not a problem in old firmware and my tune) After motor does not stall then warm up AFR is correct and idle AFR correct as per before the firmware upgrade. Engine up to operating temp and cruise driving its much richer, changed from ~14:1 to 11~10.5:1? Went to 4000rpm and 100kpa MGP and AFR went to 10.3:1???? clouds of fuel smoke out back. *this previously was ~12:1* Something is very screwed up in the transfer of this firmware?, and no way could I be stuffed retuning my whole set up to suit it honestly. Its very odd that the idle cells are correct 12.0:1 AFR (before and after) but everything else has gone richer. All sensors are right, showing correct temps and pressure and tps spans etc. Too say I am perplexed/angry/sad would sum up my mood after screwing around with this the last few days. Worst timing for this to happen too. It's looking like something has changed in my ECU or the firmware controls the injectors in a different way? I really don't know other than to share that my previously well working ECU/car is now a nugget basically, needing allot of work to fix back to the way it was.

Something has changed in the fuel algorithm too on decel return to idle especially. Exact same map but now seems to have an extra dose of fuel on trailing throttle (something I complained about at length in previous firmware) I will have to go back it seems and get rid of the fuel table I needed to set up on delta rpm decrease to counter the stalling I always had before I implemented that extra correction. It lasts for a few seconds then stabilizes back to the normal delivery. The accel pump section seems to work differently as well (yes I did rechange it back to the normal map correction instead of TPS table option now available as per the last firmware) I no longer have a persistent flat spot of idle *amazing* (again zero map changes) only implementation of new firmware. Accel fuel pump settings were always inconsistent before seemingly regardless of settings I will keenly see what it is like now. Still cant get the logging to work though? 'Index out of bounds(4)' is the error box *multiple* and it locks up the program and need to task manager and shut it down.

Happy to admit that It's official, I am a dumb kent My problem with the engine not starting is that Trigger 2 has a separate table now for SYNC reference, in the change over (although I did check it *missed it*) it was set to 'none' instead of in my case needing to be on 'Crank x1' reconfigured this and motor started. Has anyone used the logging yet? when I activate this I get multiple repeated windows saying index 4 out of bounds? and it just freezes.

Tried that makes no difference. Before when I changed to 4.4.6 firmware I did not have to take the computer out of the car, it worked and car was spot on now its caput sadly for me. The new PC Link 4.5.0 connects to the ECU and you can see all the stuff there, just the motor will not start. Something has happened in this upgrade and its beyond me. I only which I could go back to what I had before sadly that is not possible once this is installed (and that is a crap feature in my opinion cause now I have something that does not work)!

1995 RX7 plug in ECU board for what difference it makes. Board S/N = 5565 ECU Type = 13 old ECU firmware version = 4.4.6 old boot code = 1.4 What I find frustrating is that I can't go back to the 4.4.6 Firmware? so now am stuck with an ECU that wont work V's what I had yesterday that was perfect. There is a solenoid that screams under the engine bay now right after you finish cranking it over. Have all these scenarios been tested for a smooth transition? it seems in my case its not or my ECU has not gone well with the upgrade?. If anyone has an idea on it I'd love to hear it until I wait on Monday for Link to rectify it for me, hopefully. Regards.

Happy Birthday to me Changed from 4.4.6 today, first had hassel upgrading the firmware, now went to go start the motor and it wont start. Had a basically perfect set up yesterday (really happy with car), & today its turned to crap, I wish I never touched it! I hate computers and upgrades! Read through all of the notes and cant see what is wrong, what a freaking nightmare.... So stuck on weekend and no way to resolve this, feel like crap, anyone have any idea of feel like helping me then be my guest.

Hey Dave, I did not get anything form you? I have solved the stalling, but there is always a BUT. Idle AFR cannot be set leaner than 11.7 to 11.9:1, no AIT correction can be applied on closed throttle, preceding cells (lower vac) need to be set richer than is ideal, and the other thing that helps is setting up another fuel multiplier table that does a delta -rpm increase in fueling in this transient condition on a closed throttle engine decel condition, and also a fuel temperature table is mandatory on a heat soaked engine (increase fueling as fuel temp goes up). Injection angle must be set at 50 BTDC after much trial and error. With all of these things activated the engine behaves properly in all conditions and does not stall with a 875rpm idle speed setting. The engine will idle with a 13.0:1 AFR setting but will NOT work on a closed throttle return to idle test condition and will NEVER work on a fuel cut condition with a return to fuel delivery of 2500rpm. Its just a peculiarity of this ECU I need to learn to live with, its not bad, just not ideal if you are trying to optimize every last aspect of the tune up... and something I have not experienced on other ECU types running the exact same combination of parts (injectors, injector location, engine specification etc). Best Regards. Peter

In my own cars case I make use of the fuel temperature sensor in the fuel rail as it is super fussy with regard to idle AFR setting and it needs to be constantly within 0.5AFR in every operating condition. Fuel temperature (and thus density) will vary allot from overnight ambient temp to 50 deg C when running and go as hot as 90 deg C or more on a heat soaked engine, Every 10 deg C in fuel temp you really need another 1 to 2% more fuel as the density changes *gets less with more heat*. This is why this problem is never fully cured by AIT figures because as soon as the fuel circulates and the rail, reg and injectors cool after a minute of running all of a sudden the fuel mixture changes allot at idle while the intake manifold is at the same temp basically. In my car the AFR is within above band from hot shut down to 20 min heat soak restart and operating the engine from 37 deg Ambient to 5 deg C cold start. I have my fuel temp map compensation set up under one of the tables (RPM to FUEL TEMP) and it works well, only way to fully solve the issue you are having.

E-mail sent, excuse my language, just very frustrated and I have been ultra diplomatic and care free with my time/money to this point....... I have just run out of all reserves of tolerance & need this fixed.

E-Mail sent, thanks for any help.

Further to my reply and my other post on the ECU cutting out at hot ambient & ECU case temperature this problem also occurs (even despite all of the doctored settings to get the ECU to function on return to idle). I can only repeat all AFR, EGT, timing etc is correct, something decides to make the ECU not work and in combination want to stall the engine. I have repeated this dozens of times over E-Mails to various people, Australian dealers, Link office manager and fuck knows who else (I have lost count)!@ To say *I am sick of it* is an understatement (given all of the shit I have had to endure let alone monetary costs for broken parts and my labor in testing time, rebuilding my car etc) of this and last centuries combined. I would love to have just one fucking person to talk to at Link a technical person, and have responsive turn around to problems I have faced and high lighted .......... would be great too If they could keep me happy as a customer and just send me out another ECU so I can test the thing myself rather than make me jump through hoops and waste even more time and make me even more angry!!!! given all of the shit I have had to endure since this saga began.

Going down big hill and put it into a lower gear so I could show it shitting itself in the logs on deceleration. I don't need to log this cunt anymore or waste another minute of my life on the piece of garbage. Link can send me a new ECU or I can just tell everyone how many fucking hassels I have had with it and how much money and time from my life it has taken away from me due to one shitty electronic box. I am not some dickhead, I do this as a job, I don't see why the onus should be on me to prove beyond doubt that its faulty, I have already gone through this once before and wont be doing it anymore. No cunt has explained to me why this happens with temperature yet? all I get is excuses and a big fuck up run around and it shits me to death, never had to go through this level of crap before with anyone.

No you need version 4.4.6 to view them as I run special software. The only parts you need to look at is right at the beginning and under constant TPS acceleration as soon as the engine approaches 3000rpm (every time consistently) the fuel injection pulse will drop out as will the RPM. This is not random and it happens every time the ambient weather is 35+deg C and the ECU is showing about 64deg C internal temp. I need to STRESS, this ONLY happens when the ECU heats up!!!!! very consistent and very repeatable, it does not happen in the first 20 minutes of running the engine nor does it happen in cooler ambient weather conditions (ECU showing lower than 50 deg C operating temp) thus is CANNOT be anything to do with wiring nor trigger settings, as that makes no sense as the inductive pickups voltage outputs do not vary with temperature, and I would have this problem ALL THE TIME regardless of high ambient temperature and thus ECU case temperature after a period of time running in it..... I have run this engine and ECU for over 2000km (fully tuned to 8000rpm and 1.1 bar boost) and I know how it works and when it is faulty. If only someone would listen to me

Can ANYBODY with a FD3S RX7 please send me your Trigger arming threshold values for the G and Ne sensors please. I want to cross check the averages people have measured and set V's what I am going to test mine at. I have one of a ViPEC customer car and it is vastly different to what Link List in the default maps for the FD3S files they provide with the ECU. Thanks. This is the last thing I have to check/tweak, if this does not work then a 4 pound hammer will be the next resort !

My other thread vanished? My Link G4 plug in 3 times now has cut out at 3000rpm after 20 to 30 minutes driving in high ambient weather conditions (35deg C+). It will not allow the engine to exceed 3000rpm until the ECU cools down. This is not random in nature and is totally repeatable every time the ambient weather is high! and the ECU case decides to limit my motor. I sent Link a log and their engineer tells me its a trigger set up problem? funny it never happens at cooler ECU temps and all wiring is perfect and never had any issue with Apexi PFC. Opinions? Others experiences?

Basic grounding and voltage differentials aside the biggest problem with Innovate Products is the way they read the LSU sensor and its temperature sensitivity. These items can be solved however it takes the manufacture of some special heat rejection devices (I will take photos and post it up) this will cure 99% of the heat problems if not all of them. I have tested it with thermocouples attached and the inlet gas is 1150degC with a constant flame shooting out the sensor and the body temp is only 300deg C (well below the 550deg C they start giving lean spikes at). The other thing these meters do is go pear shaped in the actual accuarcy of the reading a true rich mixture (10.0:1 AFR) after sustained high heat load and I have found them to vary up to 1.00 AFR point to others in back to back tests. Reading a calibrated lambda gas from a cold pressure bottle is not the same as actually reading one at 700 to 1000 deg C in an exhaust pipe from a working engine and its where these get let down, in some applications the only reliable place to fit an Innovate meter is right at the back of a car. When I set up my meters in my own case I do it the following way. 1. Use a tail pipe probe, block one end (screw your sensor into it) 2. Fill it with butane gas or similar (gas BBQ works) block the other end 3. Monitor what the output of the AFR instrument is saying and reconcile this output with the same from your Link G4 or any other displays or logging instruments 4. Do this from 10.0:1 AFR to 20.0:1 AFR range This method takes about 10 minutes or so as the gas slowly leaks out of the probe and you can monitor the values, write down voltages to AFR relationships etc etc. It is the only way to reliably do this process and be sure that all are in sync. I use this procedure for checking all instruments be they EGT probes or pressure sensors, the time invested in making sure what your ECU or other logger captures is indeed correct is well mandatory. You should never just go off a calibration sheet and assume its going to be right. If you cant trust the output value of the instrument itself get another reference item to check it against before you believe it as gosple.

I was the original sole Australian distributor for Innovate and literally sold hundreds of LM-1's and LC-1's and can personally tell you they are garbage, I got sick of customer support and needing to work around their glitches. Short story is if you use a proper AFR instrument (not a toy) then you will have NONE of the issues they crap on about! regardless of where you place the sensor and no magical 'lean misfire spikes' LOL........ I find it funny now, but was not so amusing when I had to deal with that crap every day. I use in my own car a Japanese NEKO Corporation AF700, it feeds into my G4 and also my BLitz boost control and all three give and log exactly the same figures, and my sensor is located right of the back of the turbo. The other instrument I use is an Autronic B model meter when doing back up checks or other cars, again never ever an issue. Both of these professional instruments use lab grade NTK sensors and not the hobby shack Bosch LSU. Little tip for the day. Video of Neko AF700 here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvYkkS-07mc

I have had similar situation with my Mazda RX7 if that makes you feel any better, and to add I tune every type of ECU commonly available and the Link G4 is the only one ecu that I have experienced this on to date, it is very complex and time consuming to set up 100% correctly for all operational ranges. All I can say is you will need to use all of these extra dimensions to get it to work properly, and it is pointless to use the closed loop AFR trim feature until you have the map working as it should without any AFR input loop. I need to stress so long as all influencing variables are in check and not influencing your situation (as they did not in mine, its a pure ECU function quirk) but its worth stating as many issues can sometimes be other systems playing a part.