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Sutkale

Some trigger issues

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Do you need to retain the 60-2 or could this be changed to a lower tooth count like 12 or 24 teeth?

It´s not an absolute neseccity, I could maybe get a billet crank pulley wheel with teeth incorporeted on to it.  

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Took a scope shot from the triggers at idle after changing the cam sensor and smoothing the cam trigger wheel. Still getting some glitches on cam. A couple of questions in the scope shot with respect the cam / crank sync: 

 

trigger2406_modified_zpssy2saohv.jpg

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That looks like a very good trigger 2 signal.

We look at the tooth immediately after the gap and this is well clear of either edge on trigger 2.

One thing you could try is setting the ECU to be group fire this will lighten the processing load on the micro.

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Regarding this issue, I will install 36-1 crank trigger wheel and have a try with it. Cannot find suitable 24 or 12 teeth wheel that would fit auxilliary drive belt pulley. Howerver, I managed to get little progression with this by changing the position of cam wheel, by enabling occassional trigger error free runs on a neutral gear revving that wasn´t the case before.

Maybe a bit off topic, but have anyone else encountered any issues on a occasion where you try to capture a scope log from a trigger on a high revs and at the same time lap top disconnects? This was repeatable many times.   

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Hi Sutkale,

losing communication from ECU to LAPTOP is normally a good indication you are either,

1. Running non resistored plugs

2. Fouled or partially fouled sparkplugs.

3. Noise from alternator or ignition sources , referring to HT noise, ignition triggering signals especially if using a CDI unit.

Regards

Dave.

Edited by Dave Kriedeman

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Hi Sutkale,

losing communication from ECU to LAPTOP is normally a good indication you are either,

1. Running non resistored plugs

2. Fouled or partially fouled sparkplugs.

3. Noise from alternator or ignition sources , referring to HT noise, ignition triggering signals especially if using a CDI unit.

Regards

Dave.

Thanks Dave for the answer. I have got resistor plugs, changing of plugs doesn´t have any difference. Autronic´s CDI cables are twisted even though manufacturer states this is not neseccary. Alternator might be a source for issues, maybe for trigger issues also?

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Hi Sutkale,

I cant really remember it has been some time since I have used a 500 R, but I am sure that the use of resistored plugs is not advisable.

Are any of the output wires from the CDI to the coils near the trigger wiring,

or is your tuning usb cable near the CDI unit or wiring.

Regards

Dave.

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Hi Sutkale,

I cant really remember it has been some time since I have used a 500 R, but I am sure that the use of resistored plugs is not advisable.

Are any of the output wires from the CDI to the coils near the trigger wiring,

or is your tuning usb cable near the CDI unit or wiring.

Regards

Dave.

Hi Dave,

 

CDI output wires are at closest to cam and crank wires app. 20-30 cm, so not so close I would say. Tuning cable and ECU are in the cockpit and CDI unit in the engine compartment, thus pretty far away from each other.

This ECU and laptop break up gave me an idea to put ferrite beads around the power cables to see what type of an effect this has and wheter it would be of a help to trigger issues. Furthermore, I will put some aluminium tape around the trigger cables to increase shielding against EMI / RF. I also noticed the tuning cable is without ferrite bead at the cable end that is very usual set up with USB cables.

So lets see what will be the result.

 

Edited by Sutkale

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Had a possibility to scope the crank signal with quality digital & analogue scope. There was absolutely nothing wrong with the signal when the problem / trigger error occurs. Had no time to scope the cam signal, but will do that within few days. Hopefully there´s nothing wrong with the trigger circuit in the ECU board..:(

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Hi Sutkale,

Keep us posted please.

Regards

Dave.

I will. I will change the trigger wheel to 36-1 first and take new measurements. Try to take some video / photos and post over here too from the measurement.

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Got this thing working, no trigger issues with 36-1 wheel....:) This makes me wonder why it didn´t work with 60-2, too much load on the micro / trigger circuit?

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Hi Sutkale,

great result after so much heart ache for you.

Sometimes things are just what they are, I have had issues with trigger wheels because of the metal they were made from etc.

It is very frustrating at times and almost always leads the owner,mechanic or tuner being suspect about the ECU.

Then when the ECU is tested and gets the thumbs up, it's OK., the circle of despair starts again.

I have had trigger errors from loose timing chains and belts, trigger discs just touching pick up sensors , air gap issues you name it.

Well done anyway, you have nailed it, with the advice of Simon recommending a tooth count change.

Regards

Dave.

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Hi Sutkale,

great result after so much heart ache for you.

Sometimes things are just what they are, I have had issues with trigger wheels because of the metal they were made from etc.

It is very frustrating at times and almost always leads the owner,mechanic or tuner being suspect about the ECU.

Then when the ECU is tested and gets the thumbs up, it's OK., the circle of despair starts again.

I have had trigger errors from loose timing chains and belts, trigger discs just touching pick up sensors , air gap issues you name it.

Well done anyway, you have nailed it, with the advice of Simon recommending a tooth count change.

Regards

Dave.

Yup, this was really a pain in the arse..:D

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