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BMW E36 M3 Turbo SMG from Bulgaria


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  • 1 month later...
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Guest |646|

Hi,

One more wiring question arose.

as the car has dual vanos the solenoids MUST be wired to Aux 1-4

But the car has also 3-terminal ISC solenoid, that according to the guide should be connected to Aux 1 and Aux 2.

What can be done with this conflict?

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  • 3 months later...
Guest |646|

The car has crank and 2 x cam sensors meaning that i'll wire the crank to Trigger1, exhaust cam to Trigger2 and inlet cam to DI1. But now i noticed that only Trigger1 and Trigger2 are shielded wires in the included loom. Will the inlet cam sensor signal will be good enough runing over unshielded wire?

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Guest |646|

Thanks Ray! Sounds reasonable, will do.

Finally yesterday we were ready for first startup. Needless to say that the car started first try. :) Perfect ECU without any surprises or "undocumented features" (which for example AEM has lots of..) :) Love the usability of the VTS and ofcourse the online help. I got used to the keyboard shortcuts from day one.

Sometimes i get few Trigger1 errors during cranking or stopping the motor, but never while running. I suppose it's nothing to worry about?

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Guest |646|

I face a problem with the idle solenoid. The electric scheme that you provided seems to be not working correct. Can you confirm that it is what it should be?

I understand the logic that when vipec does not ground the corresponding Aux Out the ISC solenoid must be completely closed and opposite when vipec grounds the aux out the ISC must open. Am i correct? Pretty much as if the ISC was with spring which closes mechanically the valve when it's not energized.

In fact the ISC when not energised stays in a "middle" possition at about 50% open. When you ground the "close" pin it completely closes and when you ground the "open" ping it fully opens. I suppose all 3-wire ISC solenoids work like that. But when testing the scheme you gave the ISC stays normally at its middle position and the vipec only opens it. It never closes.

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Guest |646|

Today we worked on the Vanos control and faced two problems so far:

1. On RPM above 1500 i get constantly increasing Inlet/LH Error Count. At idle everything seems perfect.

I replaced the cable for DI1 from the stock wiring loom with shielded cable and connected it absolutely the same way as Trigger1 and Trigger2. Shield to the shields of Trigger1 and Trigger2 and the signal via short existing cable to the connector. No effect. It must be something with interference or voltage thresholds. Unfortunately there are no Filtering and arming threshold settings on DI port to play with.

2. When i do cam angle test to obtain the exhaust cam offset i set teeth number to 7 and the numbers stop moving (infact they move in the range of +/- 0.5). The help states that the smallest number should be used for the offset. In my case its 0. ( http://picbg.net/img.php?file=13e5e41809e45cb0.png ) When I set 0 for offset the "Exhaust LH position" starts to shake from 0 to 60. When i set it to the next number which is 121 in my case the position angle settles to around 0 which is the actual value. ( http://picbg.net/img.php?file=8d267c068bb51ae2.png ) Unfortunately i have vanos valve failure so i can not adjust it right now to see if the reading is really correct, but at least sounds reasonable. Is this normal. Can I rely on this reading?

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Guest |646|

New Update :)

Problem 1 seems to be fixed with reversing the polarity of the cam sensor. Now the signal is OK up to redline. Only sometimes when releasing the throttle i get error state for a split second, then again goes back to OK. Is this normal?

In fact i used this diagram:

http://www.linkecu.com/support/document ... s/G09/view

but it turned out that both cam sensors work better on my car with reversed polarity compared to the scheme. I dont know if the diagram is wrong

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Guest |646|

Currently the car has no clutch, so i did the first time setup in the garage and one thing i noticed that bothers me:

- while revving in neutral i saw that the ICV DC% does not go to 0 when revving to high RPM above 3000. Is this normal?

Currently the ICV vents to atmosphere and it seems to me that if the vipec does not close it fully while in boost i will have significant boost leak. Am i correct? Does vipec just follows blindly the idle position table no matter the TPS and MAP? If this is the case i think i should reroute the ICV in back to the airbox.

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The valve will not close off.

It should be plumbed back into the intake. Not so much of a problem on non turbo applications but if running boost its must be plumbed in between turbo and butterfly.

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  • 1 month later...
Normally they are based on TPS. See typical table below. This is from my car (2JZ-GTE VVT-i). I have not found better settings then these on my dyno.

VVT-I_tableInlet.png

Hi Ray,

Thanks for sharing. This engine has VVT for Intake only, right?

How did you find those settings? Is there a basic mapping procedure on the dyno for tuning VVT?

With BMW Dual Vanos is even harder, because both cams are adjustable. There are just too much variables to take account for.

Do the fuel and Ignition maps need tuning when adjusting the cams? This makes things even harder. What do you tune first? First do a basic fuel and ignition maps, then tune VVT for the best power and torque and then refine the fuel and egnition maybe?

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have one more question, despite my previous one is not answered yet:

Fuel equation = MAP

Open Loop table = ON

Main fuel table is rpm vs TPS

AFR target table is rpm vs MGP

Are AFR corrections based on background maths applied on the INJ PW based on the MAP of the engine below 100kpa (non boost)? For example:

car idles at 900rpm. In the main fuel table the cell at 0% TPS and 900rpm is 25. In the AFR target table i have rows for -40 MGP and -60 MGP that are all 14.7.

In my particular application is the Injector PW the same if the MAP is 45 or 55 ?

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Here are some points to consider:

  • If your MAP signal is stable enough to use in the fuel equation, then consider using it to span the tables (as MGP)
    You have no barometric correction at all with the settings you are using. To get that you need to set the fuel equation to BAP or the fuel table axis to MGP
    If you have a cammy turbo engine or multi throttle bodies, consider using a 4D tune with MGP on one table and TPS on the other. It is common to have a MGP fuel table and TPS based 4D table. That is generally how you compensate the fact that you can have the same boost pressure at two different throttle positions (same RPM) and each throttle position has completely different fuel requirements.
    AFR correction is a purely mathematical thing that alters the injection pulse width depending on the number in the AFR table. It acts on the fuel equation to add some correction based on the fact that you have said that you want more or less fuel than air. It does not use actual measured AFR in any way. It has three main purposes: To provide a record of the AFR that the engine was tuned to, to flatten the numbers in the main fuel table and to provide a means of altering the AFR of the engine after it is tuned (ie just alter the AFR number to get a corresponding change to actual AFR)
    The AFR target table should ideally be spanned off the same axis as the fuel table
    If the AFR target number is the same at two different load points, then its effect on the fuel equation is the same at those load points (as in your example, AFR target is not changing pulse width at MAP is 45 or 55)

Hope that helps and doesn't confuse things more...

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Hi Ashley!

Have you read the complete topic from the beginning and Ray's answers?

You are suggesting exactly the opposite from what's been said /not only this topic, but every one on this forum regarding ITBs and turbo/ and from what's in the base map i have from Ray.

I am done pretty much with the fuel tuning and i really like the method i am using. Until now the car has not moved outside my town so baro correction should not be an issue now. What are my options to add baro correction? I am thinking of 4D fuel table spanned off BAP to compensate. Or switching to Load=BAP/MAP Xover. Will this help?

The problem now i have is that i have a hard time to get a consistent AFR's on idle. I suspect vacuum leaks that will be examined in the next few days that may cause the car to idle sometimes at 45kpa and next time in 55kpa. And each time i need to retune the 0% TPS sites to get the right AFR. That's why i asked my previous question. OK Open Loop AFR target is not changing the PW at 45 or 55 kpa (because the values in the target AFR table are the same), but is the effective total Injector PW different at different MAP levels and same fuel map cell? I am using Load=MAP and if I read the help correct MAP is used for the main fuel equation which calculates the injector PW.

So will i get different injector PW IN MY PARTICULAR SETUP when the car is idling (900rpm, 0% TPS) if the MAP is 45 kpa and 55kpa?

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So will i get different injector PW IN MY PARTICULAR SETUP when the car is idling (900rpm, 0% TPS) if the MAP is 45 kpa and 55kpa?

Yes, as you are using MAP in the fuel equation, MAP changes and therefore so does the injector pulse width.

As for the method of fuel tuning, there are two schools of thought on this. The tuners I usually seek advice from generally do it the way I mentioned and have their good reasons for it. Ray did not agree with this method and has told people a method he believes is more suitable. I am not saying who is right or wrong. I would have to read up on how Ray recommends tuning (as it skips my memory right now) to compare the advantages and disadvantages of each method. If you are happy with the way your engine is tuned then I would not change it. Either way, the ViPEC is flexible to allow you to use one method or the other, or even a combination of both.

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tuning itb is quite tricky if you don't actually measure air mass-like on M3 ,Gt-r's... with sd and tps you try to guess as close a posible actual airflow, and than add corections iat,baro...to reflect as close as possible air mass beacuse this is what you are actually after(this is why oem use it-it also helps with accel enrichment settings)

ray's metod with tps main and map corection-is faster to map and has same resutls at wideopen throttle, the other method is map main(it also depends where you get your map from-before of after itb/best would be to use 2 map sensors) and tps corection/ harder to map-but deals better with idle and transient responce up the top is same. itb have at low opening both map and flow variations(exponential air flow variation-big 4d tps corection needed) and at high openings constant map and only flow variations(linear air flow variation -small 4d tps corection needed(a bit hard to grasp). if you check motorcycle forums you will find that this is how bikes wit efi are mapped from factory (multiple MAPxRPM tables for diffrent tps openings-starting from simplest:2 tables one for 0 tps one for 100tps from which for intermediate openings it interpoleates of course wit iat and baro correction+ gear corection to account for diffrent load , upt 10 tables of MAPxRPM 0,10,20...100tps with all corections, adding forced induction it only makes it harder. so this is why you can get better low load low tps settings with secondary 4d TPSxRPM table- but is harder to map

bellow 10 tps and above 85-90 is not much of a change , but betwen these is a lot up to 30-35% of IPW

to get read of all head aches and easy mapping -it would be great if it were an option for a maf fuel ecuation or maf to map x over(with maf to map x over sky is the limit to hp..) -a 0-5v maf(no restriction if you know how to use it)-with ford o-5v maf you ca go to 1000hp of airflow

[attachment=0]motecITB.jpg[/attachment]

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  • 3 weeks later...

Thanks! Really helpful post!

One more question.

How could i know if the stock knock sensors are good for the V88 internal amplifier? I have them connected and the unit definately hears something as i see the knock levels and counts go higher with the engine noise.

These are my current settings:

[attachment=0]VTS Knock settings.png[/attachment]

And it seems that i am getting Knk levels around 30 on full load without knocking. I am aware of the tuning strategy, my question is more related to the knock sensors. I've read that there are different types /one type is second-harmonic i think.../ and most OEM sensors are not good for aftermarket ECUs. So how should I know if the BMW M3 sensors are good for the vipec? And i can rely on them that they will not pickup just noise, but actual knock..

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  • 8 months later...

Small update:

I had one constant problem with the Inlet cam trigger.

The Inlet/LH Err counter was constantly increasing. Especially after revving while RPMs go back. Consequently the the Inlet vanos was going out of sync for couple of seconds.

My trigger setup is exactly as in the help:

Trigger1 - crank

Trugger2 - Exhaust cam

DI1 - Inlet cam

with all the settings from help.

I tried to set "Pullup Resistor" to "ON" (it is OFF in the help for BMW S52) and voila.

Not a single error anymore and the vanos is in sync all the time.

I hope this could be helpful for somebody with the same engine.

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  • 5 years later...

I greet everyone here. I ask for help in understanding the trigger offset for this engine. I have already measured all the angles, but I'm constantly mistaken in the final values for the trigger offset in "TRIGGER 2 VVT" and in "CALIBRATION" menus:unsure:.

Timing diagram.jpg

Timing graph.jpg

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Here are my presets.

I hear a flash several times and then the spark fades away:ph34r:.

pic1.jpg

pic2.jpg

pic3.jpg

The offset should be set in degrees or number of teeth?

Edited by OlegD
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