max Posted February 7, 2020 Report Posted February 7, 2020 as titled im having a problem that when the engine warms up it starts hunting at idle and ive checked the log and the ignition table will be reading 18 and the ignition angle will be reading the same then the ignition angle will drop to zero for a second then return following the ignition map then drop again. i thought it could have been trigger related but im getting no trigger errors or any other errors . has anyone got any pointers where i should start looking thanks. Quote
max Posted February 7, 2020 Author Report Posted February 7, 2020 jut looked at an older log and over the space of 10 mins or so i was getting 2 trigger 1 error counters and in the same space of time the ignition angle would drop to zero 60 plus times Quote
Ducie54 Posted February 7, 2020 Report Posted February 7, 2020 Its not overrun cuting in and out? Quote
Adamw Posted February 7, 2020 Report Posted February 7, 2020 Where's the log? If I were to hazard a guess I would say maybe idle ign control? Quote
max Posted February 7, 2020 Author Report Posted February 7, 2020 forgot to add the log here is one not the most current but same problem and a copy of the map again dont think its the current one but im on a diffrent laptop ive even looked back on my old vipec setup and it was doing the same on that Quote
Adamw Posted February 7, 2020 Report Posted February 7, 2020 Thats odd alright. I havent had a good look but im leaning towards possibly a trigger problem. Can you do us a triggerscope at idle also. Quote
max Posted February 7, 2020 Author Report Posted February 7, 2020 yes i will do it when i go back to the car whats strange it doesnt seem to do it from cold only when it warms slightly Quote
max Posted February 7, 2020 Author Report Posted February 7, 2020 its even doing it without the engine on Quote
Adamw Posted February 7, 2020 Report Posted February 7, 2020 Your cam sensor is wired back to front, Im not sure if this is the cause of the problem but thats the first thing to fix - swap the +/- wires on the cam sensor. 9 hours ago, max said: its even doing it without the engine on That is normal - dont ask me why but its always done that since way back. Not related to what you are seeing here. Quote
max Posted February 7, 2020 Author Report Posted February 7, 2020 ok will swap the wires and report back Quote
max Posted February 8, 2020 Author Report Posted February 8, 2020 changed the cam sensor wires and its still the same strange thing is from cold it doesnt do it it only starts doing it when it hits 26c water temp Quote
max Posted February 8, 2020 Author Report Posted February 8, 2020 turned idle ignition control off and it now runs much better the revs are still hunting but not as bad what other setting could effect this Quote
Ducie54 Posted February 8, 2020 Report Posted February 8, 2020 With only 11 seconds of log and no recording of idle position DC% i can only see that the engine fan kicks in once dropping you idle. Also your lambda is not tracking your target. Best to get this closer Quote
max Posted February 8, 2020 Author Report Posted February 8, 2020 ive got longer logs but it wouldnt let me post also the lambda not tracking the afr target is part of the problem. say its target idle is 980 i will set say a 4 square block were it will idle and set the number to achieve my desired afr. so say i put 20 in them 4 boxes to give the desired 14.7 but because it hasn't got a smooth idle. it then wants to drop in to the 750rpm box were that number to get the afrs right is in the 30s so its just wildly swinging the afrs so im having to alter other boxes just to get it running somewhat smooth Quote
Adamw Posted February 8, 2020 Report Posted February 8, 2020 Ok, it looks to me like we have solved the ign dropping to zero problem now, is that correct? Do your longer logs show the ign dropping to zero like it did before? BTW, if you want to attach more files then share it using google drive, onedrive, icloud drive etc. As for the idle hunting, there are a few things all contributing. Mostly though it is the throttle causing it. I would start by increasing the ISC deadband, something like 50RPM is more common for DBW. DBW idle control is too slow to give good idle control on its own - by the time it opens to increase idle RPM, there is already enough air in there for it to overshoot - then it has to close again and so on. So you need ign control to work in conjunction with it. For idle ign control to work well you are going to want smaller numbers in the idle area of your main ign table - usually around 10deg gives you enough authority for the idle ign to quickly increase torque when it needs to. So if you have 10deg in the main ign table, then you want your idle ign table to look something like this: You may have to play with the numbers either side of the zero cell if this is too aggressive. The fuel table needs to be flattened out around idle area too, switch to graphic mode and you will see what I mean. Quote
max Posted February 8, 2020 Author Report Posted February 8, 2020 hello thanks for the help yes ign dropping has no been resolved by turning idle ignition control off. so it must be an incorrect setting in there somewhere. theses were the setting i was using do these look ok i will change the other settings as suggested and report back tomorrow Quote
Ducie54 Posted February 9, 2020 Report Posted February 9, 2020 As Adam has mentioned you will need to setup up idle ignition timing to fine tune you idle fluctuations. Quote
max Posted February 9, 2020 Author Report Posted February 9, 2020 yes i will turn it back on and alter the idle ignition table but im also guessing my above idle ignition control settings are incorrect Quote
Adamw Posted February 9, 2020 Report Posted February 9, 2020 2 hours ago, max said: hello thanks for the help yes ign dropping has no been resolved by turning idle ignition control off. so it must be an incorrect setting in there somewhere. In your earlier logs with the ign timing going to zero, the idle ignition was rarely active and the table didn't even have any zeros in it so the "dropping to zero" was not resolved by turning it off. The dropping to zero was caused by the ecu losing sync every few revolutions due to the cam wiring. That's not to say however after fixing the cam wiring that you then had an idle oscillation that was related to idle ignition control. Based on your log, I would change the idle ign activation conditions just a little, try something like: MAP lockout 45kpa. RPM lockout 1300. AP lockout 0.5%. Quote
max Posted February 9, 2020 Author Report Posted February 9, 2020 ok i will try it but when i changed the cam wire round the correct way it had no effect on the original problem it was still dropping to zero every few seconds it only stopped dropping out when i disabled idle ignition control. from cold it run fine untill it hit 26c then it started doing it so at a guess it appears its something that turning on based on temp. here is the log of when i first rewired the cam the correct way and ignition idle control still active. Quote
cj Posted February 9, 2020 Report Posted February 9, 2020 try disabling VVT. Its currently configured under both trigger2 VVT & VVT cam control, and its throwing cam timing errors. From the rest of the config i'm assuming this engine doesnt have VVT anyway. Quote
max Posted February 9, 2020 Author Report Posted February 9, 2020 good spot i dont know why thats active ive never had that active or put any setting on in my life Quote
max Posted February 9, 2020 Author Report Posted February 9, 2020 done all the above and its now much better when warm it still dances around when warming up but when warm its a stable idle ive block changed the fuelling when it was warm so will wait till it cools and take a log of it starting and warming up from cold and report back Quote
max Posted February 9, 2020 Author Report Posted February 9, 2020 this is a log with all the above suggestions done its much better and stable when warm just hunts a bit warming up. excuse the start i forgot to rev it to turn the battery light out Quote
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