20v atomX problems after updating firmware

[smallthecat]

Hey, 

I recently bought a atomX and CoP kit off MRP, after connecting everything and loading the base map Barry sent over it started first pop, but was in password protected mode. I got the unlock code and unlocked the ecu then updated the firmware, reloaded the base map and since haven't been able to start the car. I have tried resetting to factory and updating again. The map sensor is also reading a value of 300 since the update, prior to updating this was a normal reading. Any tips?

[Vaughan]

what firmware was it on and what firmware did you update it to, did you read the firmware update notes.

What map sensor are you using and what is the voltage on the map sensor input?

[smallthecat]

Sorry I didn't pay attention to the firmware prior to updating, currently running 6.21.14. I did do a factory reset before the update.

 

OEM denso 5v map sensor, currently reading 3.54 volts. 

[Adamw]

Attach the tune and a log.

[smallthecat]

attached

MRP-Patch-4AG20V-Startup-COP-G4X (1).pclx PC Datalog - 2021-11-22 10;46;10 am.llgx

[Adamw]

Sorry, ignore my last comment, I had opened the wrong map.  Just taking a look again now.

 

[Adamw]

It looks to me like the MAP sensor has never been set up.  The way it is now it would be getting 300% more fuel than it wants.  It may have started once when everything was dry etc.  Calibration info for those sensors is hard to find, but the settings below should be close enough.  Also it doesnt look like the trigger offset has been adjusted so check that, clean the spark plugs, change MAP sensor settings and it shouldnt be far off running.

[smallthecat]

Sweet as will try that and see how I go. It definitely smells like its getting way too much fuel. Thought it may have been spark issue. What should my trigger offset be?

[Adamw]

1 hour ago, smallthecat said:

What should my trigger offset be?

Could be anything since the distributor can be stabed in in any position.  But if it has previously run that would suggest it is fairly close, just needs to be checked with a timing light.

[smallthecat]

On 11/22/2021 at 12:15 PM, Adamw said:

It looks to me like the MAP sensor has never been set up.  The way it is now it would be getting 300% more fuel than it wants.  It may have started once when everything was dry etc.  Calibration info for those sensors is hard to find, but the settings below should be close enough.  Also it doesnt look like the trigger offset has been adjusted so check that, clean the spark plugs, change MAP sensor settings and it shouldnt be far off running.

Hey Adam, just wondering if the resolution I'm getting on the map sensor I setup with these settings is correct? Seems erratic to me but I wouldn't know what to look for to be honest, I just thought it may be smoother 

[Adamw]

It looks like you have a max of about 98 and a min of about 18is kpa so that is the ballpark I would expect.  MAP is usually quite erratic on ITB engines which is why we normally use TP on the fuel table instead.  

[smallthecat]

On 11/22/2021 at 12:15 PM, Adamw said:

It looks to me like the MAP sensor has never been set up.  The way it is now it would be getting 300% more fuel than it wants.  It may have started once when everything was dry etc.  Calibration info for those sensors is hard to find, but the settings below should be close enough.  Also it doesnt look like the trigger offset has been adjusted so check that, clean the spark plugs, change MAP sensor settings and it shouldnt be far off running.

 

I've since deleted all other vacuums off the intake and my MAP reading is too far out to calibrate with the BAP. Is deleting the other lines going to effect the values in the linear cal table? I've got it running again but changed the values myself to bring them into range. It's idling and in general running roughly, coughing spluttering. 

[essb00]

If the MAP reading is too far out from BAP, then it means your calibration table is incorrect. 

With engine off, MAP & BAP should read +/- 5kPa from each other so you can calibrate.

[smallthecat]

25 minutes ago, essb00 said:

If the MAP reading is too far out from BAP, then it means your calibration table is incorrect. 

With engine off, MAP & BAP should read +/- 5kPa from each other so you can calibrate.

Yes I realise that the calibration table is incorrect now, would this be because I've changed the vacuums? How would I recalibrate it using the linear table? Not 100% on how to set these up or recalibrate them at all. AdamW gave me the factory map sensor info above.

[essb00]

5 minutes ago, smallthecat said:

Yes I realise that the calibration table is incorrect now, would this be because I've changed the vacuums? How would I recalibrate it using the linear table? Not 100% on how to set these up or recalibrate them at all. AdamW gave me the factory map sensor info above.

No, vacuum lines would not matter with engine not running as MAP & BAP are both reading atmospheric pressure.

What are the current readings of MAP & BAP while engine not running?

[smallthecat]

12 minutes ago, essb00 said:

No, vacuum lines would not matter with engine not running as MAP & BAP are both reading atmospheric pressure.

What are the current readings of MAP & BAP while engine not running?

Bap around 100, map around 150.

Last reading I got was BAP 98.6, Map 144.7. Set to the linear cal settings as above. 

[Adamw]

Earlier in this thread you said the voltage on the MAP input was about 3.54V with the engine off - which would be about 100Kpa.  To read 144kpa with the cal I gave it would have now have to be around 5.0V.  So something has changed, have you changed any of the wiring?     

[smallthecat]

On 4/13/2022 at 8:59 AM, Adamw said:

Earlier in this thread you said the voltage on the MAP input was about 3.54V with the engine off - which would be about 100Kpa.  To read 144kpa with the cal I gave it would have now have to be around 5.0V.  So something has changed, have you changed any of the wiring?     

Yes I re wired everything

with new connectors etc.

[Adamw]

Then you have done something wrong with the MAP wiring.  Pinout is wrong or you have 5V shorted to signal or something.  You should have about 3.5-3.6V coming out of the MAP sensor at atmospheric pressure.  

Unplug the sensor while watching PC Link, if the AN voltage drops to 0.0V when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate the pinout is wrong.  If the voltage doesnt drop when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate there is a short somewhere.

[smallthecat]

2 hours ago, Adamw said:

Then you have done something wrong with the MAP wiring.  Pinout is wrong or you have 5V shorted to signal or something.  You should have about 3.5-3.6V coming out of the MAP sensor at atmospheric pressure.  

Unplug the sensor while watching PC Link, if the AN voltage drops to 0.0V when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate the pinout is wrong.  If the voltage doesnt drop when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate there is a short somewhere.

Roger. Probably the pinout. Will try that out later on and check pinout. Doesn't run very nicely with the map reading incorrectly. I used your 16v with 20v itb fuel table and ign table I found on another thread as it seemed like a close alternative for a startup as I had lost my previous tunes, I was having trouble with pc link acquiring a connection to the ecu so reinstalled it and during that troubleshooting process and lost my old data unfortunately. 

[smallthecat]

10 hours ago, Adamw said:

Then you have done something wrong with the MAP wiring.  Pinout is wrong or you have 5V shorted to signal or something.  You should have about 3.5-3.6V coming out of the MAP sensor at atmospheric pressure.  

Unplug the sensor while watching PC Link, if the AN voltage drops to 0.0V when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate the pinout is wrong.  If the voltage doesnt drop when you unplug the sensor then that would indicate there is a short somewhere.

Unplugging gives me a 0v reading. My tps also reads 4.95v on pc link. Is it an earthing issue? I'm confident my pinouts are correct. If I unplug and test the connector it reads 4.99v to the map sensor and the signal reads .03v unplugged. Both of earth's are to seperate earthing points on the block. And I have a solid earth to the oe chassis earth from block. 

[Adamw]

That really sounds like the pinout is wrong.  Can you give us a photo of the map sensor and the loom/mating connector and tell us which wires are which.

[smallthecat]

24 minutes ago, Adamw said:

That really sounds like the pinout is wrong.  Can you give us a photo of the map sensor and the loom/mating connector and tell us which wires are which.

1 - ground to ground out

2 - signal to an volt 2 

3 - 5v to 5v+ 

 

Only info I have is this. 

1  - e2 sensor ground 

2 - pim? 

3 - vc ? 

[smallthecat]

Start Up Tune V2.pclx TriggerScopeLog.llgx PC Datalog - 2022-04-17 4;53;59 pm.llgx 

So I changed the Map sensor to a Honda sensor that works. Car starts, but only running on 2 cylinders. unplgging coil 3 and 4 to test them showed they weren't firing.

Tests through ecu to injectors and coils are fine all have a signal and work when tested to the correct cylinder. I've just changed the rear main seal as it went last start up, so ideally want to fix this issue before I start it again, gearbox out and in isn't fun. Compression tests on all 4 cylinders read between 200-220psi. Haven't done a leak down test as my compressor shat itself just as I was about to do it. Is there anything wrong with attached tune, triggers, log that stand out?

Cheers

9 minutes ago, smallthecat said:

Start Up Tune V2.pclx 363.7 kB · 1 download TriggerScopeLog.llgx 18.17 kB · 1 download PC Datalog - 2022-04-17 4;53;59 pm.llgx 1.44 MB · 1 download  

So I changed the Map sensor to a Honda sensor that works. Car starts, but only running on 2 cylinders. unplgging coil 3 and 4 to test them showed they weren't firing.

Tests through ecu to injectors and coils are fine all have a signal and work when tested to the correct cylinder. I've just changed the rear main seal as it went last start up, so ideally want to fix this issue before I start it again, gearbox out and in isn't fun. Compression tests on all 4 cylinders read between 200-220psi. Haven't done a leak down test as my compressor shat itself just as I was about to do it. Is there anything wrong with attached tune, triggers, log that stand out?

Cheers

So in firing order its firing on 1 and 3, 4 and 2 not firing. 

[Adamw]

The triggerscope shows nothing.  Can you do another one, make sure you click the capture button when the engine is cranking or running, not before.  

I dont see much else that would cause two cylinders to be missing.  Do the ITB's look synced?  If you pull #4 coil out and run it with an old spark plug fitted where you can see it, is there a spark?

You can also try increasing and decreasing the engine capacity setting which is an easy way to give it more or less fuel as a test to see if it is too lean or similar.  Try it at say 2000cc to see if it makes any difference.