Requirement for a Stock 4age 16v with ITB intake?

[TszFung]

First of all , sorry for my bad english

I have a AE86 with stock 4age 16v also stock ecu and put on the itb intake already.

And now on i am planning to use link ecu atomx to replace the stock one for correcting the data only.

i just want to run better for itb.

But i am confusing what do i need , so can you please help me

My 86 spec:

1983 zenki apexi trueno, with air-con, power steering , itb, then every thing stock!

Thankyou very much!

[DerekAE86]

Do you plan to run a Idle Control Valve along with the ITBs? It can be done without it but it's just a little more fiddly.
And are you going to use the factory Ignitor and Distributor or are you converting to Coil on Plug?

Luckily the AE86 and 4AGE is a very simple setup. But my suggestions would be:
Replace the factory Narrowband Oxygen sensor with a Wideband sensor. If you use a CAN (Like the Link CAN Lambda) sensor it will free up an analog input on the AtomX.
Also add an Intake Air Temp sensor near the ITBs, or in the airbox if you plan to run the ITBs inside a airbox.
And a Fuel Pressure sensor so you can take full advantage of modelled fueling control.

The AtomX only has 2 digital inputs - so it just depends what you would like to prioritize for them:
You can connect your A/C button (or clutch activation signal) to one input so the ECU knows when Aircon is on.
Or you can connect the transmission speed signal from the guage cluster to an input so the ECU knows how fast you're travelling.
Another option is to install a knock sensor.

You can use the factory Water Temp sensor, Throttle Position Sensor and Trigger wires (But I would suggest using the CAS from a 4AGZE if you plan to run COPs)
The ECU has a MAP sensor built into it so you can remove the factory MAP sensor - and no need to use the AFM from the ITBs (If you got them from a Silvertop)
If you have the standard clutch fan on the water pump pulley there is no need to add electric thermofans - but you can if you'd like extra control and cooling capacity.

If you keep the factory distributor and ignitor the factory tacho will still work - however if you convert to COPs you'll have to either modify your guage cluster tacho to accept the lower voltage signal being output by the ECU or add a "tacho booster" to amplify the ECU's tacho signal to something the factory gauge cluster can read.

[koracing]

The Atom does not have a built in MAP sensor - you would have to move up to the Monsoon for that.  I'd go to the Monsoon just for the greater number of inputs/outputs.

[DerekAE86]

On 5/3/2023 at 12:30 AM, koracing said:

The Atom does not have a built in MAP sensor - you would have to move up to the Monsoon for that.  I'd go to the Monsoon just for the greater number of inputs/outputs.

Oh it doenst? I didnt look that closely. Oops.

[TszFung]

Thankyou so much!

so can you plz tell me how to do with the factory distributor if I keep it and also how to do it I use the ignition coil?

Then how about the fuel injector? I should change it? And where can I get them?

[DerekAE86]

The PCLink software has a really good helpfile so most of your questions regarding to actually setting up the Link will be answered there.
There are Base tune files availble for the 4AGE that utilize the factory setup so you can load and it should just work (well enough to start tuning the car)

The differences is in how you wire it up. I believe there are some resellers that will sell you a Link AtomX and a Harness premade for a 4AGE 16v. MRP in NewZealand for example do:

https://www.mrpltd.co.nz/product/ae86-4age-link-atomx-g4-kit/

They will be able to answer most of your questions and concerns if you're not confident in doing it all yourself.

As for injectors - the factory injectors (220cc I think?) should be fine. But if they're the same ones from 40years ago it's probably time to get them cleaned or take the opportunity to buy some newer/slightly larger ones.

[TszFung]

Will the tachometer work fine if I do the COP

[DerekAE86]

No. But you have 2 options to fix it;

You can modifiy the circuit inside the tach to accept the signal from the ECU.
Or you can put a "Signal Booster" inbetween the ECU and the Tacho.

Fair bit of info on both options around the internet as its a super common issue.

[TszFung]

How about the injectors? Stock one seems 1,3 connect together and 2,4 together.

But link ecu is 1,2,3,4 separately.

Do I need to separate them if I use stock injectors first ?

[DerekAE86]

Early 4AGE's did whats known as "Batch Injection" where 2 cylinders would inject at the same time. This was probably more to do with design / technology constraints than anything else. For the 20v engines they went to full sequencial injection.

I don't see any particular advantage of staying Batch when going to an aftermarket ECU that has enough outputs to drive the injectors individually.

[koracing]

If you look at some engine wiring diagrams, the earlier batch injection 4AGE appear to wire all 4 injectors to both injector outputs.  I would test with a multimeter to see if this is the case, but given the choice I would definitely plan on going full sequential injection with each injector being driven by a discrete driver.

[TszFung]

How about the a/c ?

How to deal with air condition wiring?

I have the a/c amplifier

[essb00]

About the A/C, it would only matter to connect it to Link ECU if you are to have IACV... But if you would stay with just the aux air valve for idle control, then the A/C amp plus idle-up VSV will do.
Depending on the Link ECU you'll be using (if you have extra DI and aux output), you could still make use of the A/C control and make use of some control features (e.g. off A/C clutch when TPS is above 75%, off A/C clutch above 3.5krpm, off A/C clutch when launch control on, etc.).

BTW, if you are to use the stock AE86 injectors, don't forget to wire the resistor block - as the stock injectors are low impedance.

[DerekAE86]

If you've removed the stock engine fan that is bolted to the water pump pulley and going to use electric thermalfans then it is a good idea to wire the AC Button or Clutch Engage into the Link just so you can force the fans on when AC is turned on regardless of coolant temp.

[TszFung]

On 5/2/2023 at 6:12 PM, DerekAE86 said:

Do you plan to run a Idle Control Valve along with the ITBs? It can be done without it but it's just a little more fiddly.
And are you going to use the factory Ignitor and Distributor or are you converting to Coil on Plug?

Luckily the AE86 and 4AGE is a very simple setup. But my suggestions would be:
Replace the factory Narrowband Oxygen sensor with a Wideband sensor. If you use a CAN (Like the Link CAN Lambda) sensor it will free up an analog input on the AtomX.
Also add an Intake Air Temp sensor near the ITBs, or in the airbox if you plan to run the ITBs inside a airbox.
And a Fuel Pressure sensor so you can take full advantage of modelled fueling control.

The AtomX only has 2 digital inputs - so it just depends what you would like to prioritize for them:
You can connect your A/C button (or clutch activation signal) to one input so the ECU knows when Aircon is on.
Or you can connect the transmission speed signal from the guage cluster to an input so the ECU knows how fast you're travelling.
Another option is to install a knock sensor.

You can use the factory Water Temp sensor, Throttle Position Sensor and Trigger wires (But I would suggest using the CAS from a 4AGZE if you plan to run COPs)
The ECU has a MAP sensor built into it so you can remove the factory MAP sensor - and no need to use the AFM from the ITBs (If you got them from a Silvertop)
If you have the standard clutch fan on the water pump pulley there is no need to add electric thermofans - but you can if you'd like extra control and cooling capacity.

If you keep the factory distributor and ignitor the factory tacho will still work - however if you convert to COPs you'll have to either modify your guage cluster tacho to accept the lower voltage signal being output by the ECU or add a "tacho booster" to amplify the ECU's tacho signal to something the factory gauge cluster can read.

Sorry but how to run the idle control without the idle valve ? Since I want to deal with cold start and a/c on idling

[dx4picco]

Your only lever for that would be idle ignition angle. Open you butterfly throttle a bit more and have a somewhat more retarded target timing with warm engine (0° to 5atdc) and increase for cold start and potentially ac

[TszFung]

Do you mean I have to give a little gas if I don’t have the idle control valve?

when cold start, I have 600rpm and less then 10.5 a/f gauge reading , I have to rev the engine to 1100rpm to get 13.0 a/f. Is it possible to reach 1100rpm itself without giving gas and valve? Is it too rich on cold start idle? My ignition timing is 10°, 14.7 a/f and 850rpm when it reach 85°c, quite good and smooth when warm idle

[essb00]

Post a copy of your tune file & PC log when starting from cold to normal operating temp.

[koracing]

On 3/15/2024 at 5:50 AM, TszFung said:

Do you mean I have to give a little gas if I don’t have the idle control valve?

when cold start, I have 600rpm and less then 10.5 a/f gauge reading , I have to rev the engine to 1100rpm to get 13.0 a/f. Is it possible to reach 1100rpm itself without giving gas and valve? Is it too rich on cold start idle? My ignition timing is 10°, 14.7 a/f and 850rpm when it reach 85°c, quite good and smooth when warm idle

An engine will require more air when cold than when warm to reach your desired idle speed. Without an idle valve or without setting the throttle such that it idles at target when cold, it's usually going to require throttle input when cold to get it up to the idle speed you want. 

The trade off of having no idle control valve is you can either have it idle on target when cold, and then possibly have too high of an idle speed when warm, or you have desired idle speed when warm, but too low of an idle speed when cold.  The first scenario can sometimes be corrected by significantly reducing ignition advance at idle when warm (or by using ignition idle control with a lower ignition idle limit possibly into the negative region).  

[TszFung]

Sorry here I am again! Too busy that I left my 86 long time.

i am going to use my stock distributor to pick the trigger signal, can anyone please tell me about the wiring? Which wire I should pick from the distributor plug and wire it to which pin on the link ecu plug? And also I can use this trigger to make the coil on plug later on right?🤔

so far I know I have to remove 3 teeth out of 4, but I have found that the inner part have 24teeth? Is there any thing that I should do with that?

[Adamw]

There are a few variations of 4AGE distributors.  If yours has a wire tail that hangs out the side then it is usually easy to work out by looking at the wire colours inside.  The ground wire is usually white or cream colour, it is easy to identify as it splits into 2 or 3 wires inside and goes to all sensors.  Connect this to Atom pin 7.

The lower 24T sensor usually has a red wire, connect this to trigger 1 - Atom pin 8.

The upper sensor (some have 2 upper sensors), usually a green wire, connect this to trigger 2 - Atom pin 9.  Leave the other upper sensor not connected to the ecu.  

For the toothed wheels, leave the bottom wheel unmodified, so the ECU sees 24T per revolution.  For the top wheel we want just a single tooth per revolution, if yours has 4 teeth, then cut off 3 teeth to leave just one.  It doesnt matter which one you choose to keep.