EvocentriK
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Posts posted by EvocentriK
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Appreciate the detailed explanation and corrective action. I’m about to tackle this myself and you probably saved me some headaches!!
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4 hours ago, Adamw said:
In G4+ from memory only Aux 1-8 can do open or closed loop PWM FP speed. Aux 9-16 and inj/ign drives can only do x-over mode.
Thanks Adam, I moved it over to AUX2 (which I don't use as I deleted the intercooler sprayer) and it works in PWM mode but lord the pump makes a racket, even at 900Hz drive frequency. Not sure I can live with that, wonder if its harmful to the pump as well. In this mode it appears there's no control over the prime time either - it's a short on cycle only, maybe 500ms.
I was not able to get Inj drives 5 or 6 (by default those used in the stock setup for Fuel Pump and FP Speed) to trigger the SSR relay even in Test ON mode. I was measuring 0.024v to ground when the Inj drive state was ON, are they not pulled up to 6-12v?
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On 9/27/2022 at 9:47 AM, FDFRory said:
Curious on this same thing as well. What type of aftermarket solenoid do you recommend buying?
You've probably sorted this out by now but I'd just grab a used one from a wrecker from any car and try it.
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On 2/28/2021 at 1:57 PM, EvocentriK said:
Thanks Adam, appreciate the input.
I have a 150A main breaker that the SSR supply is connected to if I need to isolate for some reason (pic above).
The FP Speed mode doesn’t have configurable frequency for PWM, what is it set to?
If the SSR doesn’t like >100hz how will this manifest? Heat? Shutdowns?
Hi, just revisiting this for assistance please.
In the manual in the auxillary wiring function table it states FPSpeed is for generalXover mode only. Is that correct? It seems at odds with the explanation of Fuel Pump Control where FP Speed mode is required when using Open Loop Control method via PWM. Problem is, there is no Hz field when using FP Speed, so how do I have any control over the frequency being used to drive the SSR? Thanks -
4 hours ago, Adamw said:
You can use the open loop PWM fuel pump control function. Those crydom and other cheap SSR's generally dont like driving a motor at any more than about 100Hz and some pump make quite a growl at that. But give it a try. The note in the help file is comparing to proper fuel pump control modules which would typically work at ~20KHz.
Yes use an ign or inj drive if it is live all the time to prevent backfeed. However be aware SSR's usually fail "closed" so consider the safety factor if you dont have an isolator or some other easy way to disable. Dedicated PWM fuel pump controllers are generally designed to fail open, whilst dedicated fan controllers are designed to fail closed.
There is a prime function built in to the open loop fuel pump control function.
Thanks Adam, appreciate the input.
I have a 150A main breaker that the SSR supply is connected to if I need to isolate for some reason (pic above).
The FP Speed mode doesn’t have configurable frequency for PWM, what is it set to?
If the SSR doesn’t like >100hz how will this manifest? Heat? Shutdowns?
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8 hours ago, ellisd1984 said:
I'm wanting to do something similar. I'm using a PWM control module out of a subaru in my celica GT Four, I'm just waiting for a few connectors before I can have a go at it.
Did your car have any sort of speed control for the fuel pump originally? Mine had a resistor pack fed via a relay that would drop the voltage to the pump at idle & cruise. I've done away with this but I'm using the those output for my new setupHi, yes I’ve seen people use Subaru or Jag/Aston fuel pump controllers. I’m wanting to use something brand new and easy to purchase like a high quality SSR instead of a used OEM module from another model of car. I’ll protect it from backfeed with a 40A schottky diode across the SSR pump feed output and SSR ground terminal.
The stock evo system uses a relay to drive either a resistor pack or to energise a 2nd relay for direct voltage feed in an antiquated 2 speed system. Like you I want to do away with all this and simplify the setup.
Phase 2 for me is adding a surge tank with the same kind of PWM / 2 speed based pump control for that but I want to get this phase 1 setup working first and prove the design before I do.
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Hi guys, I am setting up a simple fuel pump power supply & control circuit.
I wish to have 2 or 3 pump speeds to avoid unnecessary fuel heating at idle and cruise.
I'd like 50% pump DC at 0-5% injector duty cycle and 100% pump DC at 10% injector duty cycle and higher.
The easiest way I can see to so this is using Injector Drive 5 and changing it from the default Fuel Pump to FP Speed mode. I can set up the FP Speed table to give me the above IDC triggers for the pump DC% i wish to have. Problem is I cannot see what PWM Frequency this auxillary output uses. There is a note in Help saying this is not for use with SSR's as they cannot switch fast enough, but from what I can see these Aux outputs max out at 300Hz. My Crydom DC100D40 SSR can be driven at 900Hz. Will this work for me or am I missing something and the help file is outdated?
If I used the above method and it was actually being driven at 300Hz via Injector Drive 5, I set Polarity to HIGH, correct? I belive this will give me 0% duty = 100% driven to ground and 100% duty = 100% driven to 12v.
Following on from that, for simplicities sake I wanted to wire the SSR power feed direct to the battery (car side of 150A breaker at the battery) but take this to be constant 12v. With the way the Injector Drive aux outputs are configured, ie: no freewheeling diodes (right?) this will not result in backfeeding, unless I am missing something...
If this isn't going to work as I expect (perhaps its driving at 4000Hz or something undocumented) I will need to set up Aux 2 in GP PWM mode to drive the SSR. If I have to resort to this, will this impact the ability to direct wire the SSR to the battery unswitched 12v? Secondly, how in this configuration do I get the pump to prime on key on but then turn off after x seconds? Does Fuel Pump Control have any impact at all when using an aux output like Aux 2 as a GP PWM to drive a controller?
Thanks in advance -
It may not for many, but it does for an EVO CT9A, FYI. The high voltage triggers the ACD pump into an ON state.
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Rpm limiter
in G4+
Yeah those settings are a bit wacky. For an RPM limit you probably want to start with something like 60% cut and end at 90% cut across a control range of something like 200 rpm. If you set the cut effect to constant instead of adaptive you will have a much faster cut effect but it's harder on the valvetrain especially as it doesn't share the cut between cylinders so be careful, especially on engines that don't like aggressive cuts.
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10 hours ago, Adamw said:
Pin 20 is high speed fan on Evo 4/5/6, and some Evo 7, it is not used on most 7's and not used on any 8's.
You can use any of those pins - just make sure there is nothing connected to the other 2 that you arent using.
Ok, thanks Adam. All done with the ECU side, just need to make the coil harness now. As a note, I really wish the Link manual had better documentation. Understanding the differences between the models is critical when working with a 'multi-fit' ECU type. I'd wager you'd get a lot less support posts and contact if the manual had clearer tables and specific pinout / wiring info pertaining to each model the plug-in is supposed to work with so the end user could refer to the section for their specific application. You guys are fantastic online and on the phone, it would be good to try and lower the support request rate though I'm sure!
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2 hours ago, Adamw said:
Yes pin 35 is connected to Ign 5. The current manual shows this
Ign 4 is connected to Pin 20,32 & 34, As far as I know the factory ECU's also turn both condensor fans on together (even though they are called high/low and are wired to separate pins) - at least it does on my JDM evo 7. The main reasoning for us combining them is the factory fan relays are what we call "hot fed" - they are live all the time even when ign is off. If you use a normal aux output to drive this type of circuit then they will back feed when ign is off and flatten the battrery. So they need to be connected to ignition outputs which dont have flywheel diodes so dont back feed. There are only 4 spare ign outputs so you dont really want to waste 3 of them just to have two speed AC fan. They are combined just to give the user more flexibility to have spare outputs to do other stuff.
The best option will be to connect the wire from pins 20,32 & 34 all to Ign 7. You can wire 1 of them them to Ign 8 and control independantly if you really wanted to (GP Output can be set up to do fan type functionality) but personally I would wire them together and keep the valuable ign output spare for something else.
Thanks Adam. My factory ECU has no wire at Pin 20. This agrees with the online pinout for the Evo 7 harness. It has wiring at Pins 19 (air flow reset) and 21 (rad fan speed), whereas the Link manual shows NC for Pin 19 and IGN4 at Pin 20. This isn't correct, at least for my vehicle and other evo 7's. So it would seem that only Pins 32 and 34 are related to the AC Fan (Engine Fan 3)?
Given I have no wire at PIN20, and I will move Pin 32 and Pin 34 to IGN7 on the expansion harness, should I wire IGN4 for the 4th coil trigger to pin 20, 32, or 34?
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Hi again, I am converting my evo 7 to sequential ignition. I know I need to reassign IGN3 and IGN 4 to ignition type, which means the AC Clutch (Pin 22) and AC Fan Hi (Pin 32) and AC Fan Low (Pin 34) need to be moved to other IGN channels. I elected to use IGN5 for the AC Clutch and IGN7 (expansion harness 1) for the AC Fan. Since I have deleted the FPR Solenoid (Pin 3) and SAS solenoid (Pin 53), I am repurposing those wires to act as my IGN triggers since they're already run in the harness and would otherwise be redundant.
My first question is IGN5 is OFF in the tune file as default and Link manual says NC for this pin (35). However my car has a 12v wire on this pin, and an online wiring diagram calls this out as IC Spray activation light. Why does the Link Manual say NC for this pin? I use the intercooler spray switch manual and auto modes for other purposes and I have deleted the spray system, am I right to just insulate and tuck the 12v wire and repurpose IGN5 for AC Clutch?
Second, the Link manual states pins 32 and 34 are both IGN4, my wiring diagram calls these AC Fan Hi (Pin 32, Green/Red wire) and AC Fan Low (Pin 34, blue wire) - each has it's own wire of a different colour why would they be connected to only one pin/function on the ECU side? Does the Link not natively have the capacity to drive the fan in two speed states?The tune has IGN4 defined by deafult as Engine Fan 3 as its function. Where do I move both these wires from pins 32 and 34 so that I can use IGN4 for an ignition coil trigger? Do I insulate and tuck the low wire, and drive only the high wire from IGN7? It wouldn't make sense to move Pin 32 to IGN7 and Pin 34 to IGN8 becuase they both cannot be Engine Fan 3 type nor could each be controlled independtly that way...
Bit bizarre the way the link doesn't seem to properly control the OE functions, makes things like this needlessly confusing. If you could please shed some light on my options that would be most appreciated!!
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10 hours ago, Adamw said:
You originally said you wanted to disable the 2 speed mode and run the 2nd pump continuous. Changing the output function to GP output will do that. So if thats what you want to do you shouldnt be using the FP Speed function.
For the stock Evo set-up with the two speed FP Speed function the control settings are found in >Auxiliary Outputs>Fuel pump control. The Evo 4-8 uses the General X-over mode and our base map default settings have the pump switching to high speed mode at 2000RPM or 5% injector duty cycle.
Yes, I had a 2 part question, one part is what I would like to do next in terms of fuel pump configuration, the other (the question you just answered) was for my own interest about how the default setup operated, since when you select FP Speed, unlike GP Output, there are no conditions to determine its operation.
Thanks again.
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On 10/20/2020 at 8:10 PM, ozyvr4 said:
I saw more parameters added to the generic can stream. Was ethanol content added? I have a Haltech IC7 and it does not have ethanol content in there list for the link template. Im hopeful.
Can't you just add it in? I added some parameters that the Generic dash didn't have to send to my Plex display. Unless the issue is you cannot configure the Haltech end?
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Thanks very much for the explanation Adam. So just to confirm, my question
“What is the trigger for cutting over to the speed relay from the normal relay? The stock ECU has a configurable load value to achieve this. Are these outputs configurable somehow? ”
is this hard coded in somewhere and not configurable when FP SPEED is selected as the function?
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Hi, forgive me if this is covered somewhere but I’ve not found it. The stock evo ECU uses a two voltage relay setup for the fuel pump. The trigger for the second high voltage relay is load based.
The LinkG4+ seems to have two aux output to trigger the fuel pump relay, FP Relay and FP Speed Relay. What is the trigger for cutting over to the speed relay from the normal relay? The stock ECU has a configurable load value to achieve this. Are these outputs configurable somehow?
I want to potentially delete the 2-speed mode and use the FP relay output to drive the in-tank pump and the FP Speed output to drive the surge tank pump via a trunk mounted direct wire to battery solid state relay circuit. But I’d need them both on constantly rather than the in tank pump switching from low to high mode based on some variable. -
Thanks gents, much appreciated. I’ll delete the FPR solenoid and rewire pin 9 to an AUX configured for purge.
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Hi, just wondering if anyone can assist with this. The stock Evo ecu triggers this solenoid to open under certain conditions (I believe it to be on cruise) allowing the intake manifold vacuum to pull tank fuel vapour into the intake manifold. The solenoid is closed under other driving conditions. There is also a check-valve between the solenoid and the evap canister in the engine bay (JDM vehicle). It is labelled Evapourative Emission Purge Solenoid in the attached diagram.
Does the Link G4+ PNP ecu also have logic to control this solenoid in the same way as OEM? I am installing an aftermarket intake manifold and trying to do the right thing here and retain this system if possible, but there's no point custom mounting the solenoid and running wiring/vac line if its not activating.In the same vein, does the Link ECU also activate the Fuel Pressure Solenoid on hot starts?
Thanks!
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Cool, will check this out thankyou
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2 hours ago, kool021 said:
Lil bit confused so trigger cylinder 3 and 4 will be going to ecu pins that control AC clutch and ac condenser? By any chance you know what pin number are they? Our ecu is 3 plug like the evo 8 MR I think Also cylinder 1 and 2 I can use those wires already in the engine bay?
Download the manual PDF man, there's a pinout guide in there for you to refer to.
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All sorted and programmed, I just created a new channel and set up the extra parameters I needed that were not contained within the generic dash stream.
Thanks again @Adamw
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2 hours ago, Adamw said:
See if this helps: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AiYbYlZQuRHPtGpksumYRqo5cH7A?e=L0nxEN
Thank you so much Adam, that’s really fantastic and clears up my questions. I’ll work through developing my own and see how I go now.
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15 minutes ago, Adamw said:
Did you try following the Link specific "how to add channels" instructions here?:
Hi Adam, Yes I did and that’s where my question about the ID HEX value came from. The Plex example there highlights the ID HEX field and says this value comes from the Link side. I don’t see anything on the link side setup or in the help file about the ID HEX value. Where does it come from?
lambda target axis setup vs fuel table
in G4+
Posted
No so be aware of the difference between MGP (gauge pressure or what you and I would call boost pressure) and MAP (manifold absolute pressure aka boost + 14.5 psi).
in your example
MGP axis = actual boost = 20 psi
MAP axis (eg: setting up safety limits) = absolute pressure = 34.5 psi