hc96x COP wiring help (k20 coils, aem epm)

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

Hey,

So, my distributor is on the way out, and I'm in the process of looking at replacement options.
I've been planning on turboing my b16a2 for a while now (have half the goodies. Just need manifold and exhaust stuff), but figured it might be worth going coil on plug for ease of use, since the dizzy's tend to be a pain to source (well, lasting ones anyway).

So, I looked around, and found a few guides for it for obd1 engines, and/or the aem cop kit itself.
But, k20 coils and the aem epm seems to be the better way to go, since it can handle more boost and power (vs the aem pencil coils and ignitor being limited to 15psi).

I have yet to install the link, so doing this I'd probably get it all installed. Engine is still stock, but it'd save me a bit of drama down the track more than likely. Can at least get the base stuff dialled in before turboing I guess, if that helps?

So, looking all around for diagrams and write ups, I've found basically nothing for obd2 setups. Only obd1, or aem cop kits.
About 3 hours of scouring, and finally looked in the manual, and found there's 4 ignitition signal ports.

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, using the hussain-vtec diagram; of the epm,
pin 1: crank signal/ trigger to c-12
pin 2: ground to head, along with the coils grounds to head.
pin 3: cam signal/ trigger to c-4
pin 4: ignition pos to a-24 plus coils pos

Then coils signals themselves;
Cyl1: a20
cyl2: a21
cyl3: a31
cyl4: a32

Does that seem right?
Am I missing anything from the equation here? I feel like I am.
Might've mixed up pins here or there. Using the above mentioned hussain-vtec diagram (link) that was corrected by another user, which got him going. Then finding the obd1 ecu pinouts, and the obd2a pinouts, and finding the matching thing. Then also double checking on the manual for the hc96x.

Is that pretty much it?
Cause if so, I'm down to boogy and get this car not running like poo, and on the road to a stronger/ more reliable boost setup down the track (if it all goes ahead, otherwise just a fun daily na setup).

Cheers

[Adamw]

Avoid the AEM EPM, I have seen many users with different ecu's have many problems with them.  The stock reluctor in the distributor is a more accurate and reliable trigger.

Your proposed ignition pins are correct.  

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

8 hours ago, Adamw said:

Avoid the AEM EPM, I have seen many users with different ecu's have many problems with them.  The stock reluctor in the distributor is a more accurate and reliable trigger.

Your proposed ignition pins are correct.  

Only issue with that is the stock distributor is basically about to explode/ seize.
I can rebuild it, but figured the epm would be a much easier option. 
I suppose there is otherwise using a cam gear trigger point. That's another thing that's sold and is apparently more reliable/ accurate

[Adamw]

Yeah the T1 Cam trigger is definitely a better option than the AEM EPM, although I think I remember there was a user on here a little while ago that received one DOA.  Again I think probably no better than a stock distributor though.  Both of these items were considered upgrades only because the old AEM honda plug-in ECUs that were common in the USA in the '90s & 2000's had crap VR conditioners that would rarely work with the factory distributor. 

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

17 minutes ago, Adamw said:

Yeah the T1 Cam trigger is definitely a better option than the AEM EPM, although I think I remember there was a user on here a little while ago that received one DOA.  Again I think probably no better than a stock distributor though.  Both of these items were considered upgrades only because the old AEM honda plug-in ECUs that were common in the USA in the '90s & 2000's had crap VR conditioners that would rarely work with the factory distributor. 

From my understanding, it's mainly because the only real way to go with the hondas is the oem distributor, cause it seems the aftermarket scene is full of duds. No idea why, but apparently they either leak straight away or shortly into life, or just fail. And because oem is the only way to go, and rebuilding is getting harder and harder, doing this is a good way to avoid bad seals and bearings and what not.

That and the internal parts not being the most accurate, so this is about the same, but at least puts the ignitor/ coil on top, making it better and what not. Plus also gets you with the whole not dealing with aftermarket distributor seals and stuff.

I've been looking around for options, but it seems either rebuilding and running a cover (though I'm struggling to find the parts needed to rebuild, and local honda can't get anything bar the rotor, cap, coil and inducer. No bearing, seals etc. Could potentially get the bearing from a local bearing shop), or running the epm.
It does seem like a good option at the least if it does work, cause that way you don't need to worry about distributor bearings and seals shitting the bed hardcore, and messing up timing and stuff. But, I suppose that's also a potential for the epm maybe?
I dunno. Just seemed like the best way to go from what I could find, aside from the t1 cam trigger. But the cam trigger thing made me wonder how it'd do crank timing, whether you'd need a crank timer as well or something, or if it does that as well on the cam gear. And then what you'd use to cover the hole from the dizzy.
But, ideally leaving the oem dizzy would be my aim. Just cause of how hard it's getting to source them, and get good replacements and/or parts to fix it (at least from my poor search skills)

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

On 10/18/2020 at 4:36 PM, Adamw said:

Yeah the T1 Cam trigger is definitely a better option than the AEM EPM, although I think I remember there was a user on here a little while ago that received one DOA.  Again I think probably no better than a stock distributor though.  Both of these items were considered upgrades only because the old AEM honda plug-in ECUs that were common in the USA in the '90s & 2000's had crap VR conditioners that would rarely work with the factory distributor. 

Sorry to bump so late. Been in talks with a friend, and he's said oem dizzy would be best, and agrees with you. He's supplying me with a bunch of parts to get the turbo swap all ready, but he wants to check what the best method is for CoP conversion.

I've been scouring the forums a little bit for info regarding it with oem dizzy. Seems it should be fairly easy to wire in. Just wire up the coils, set the ecu, pull the unneeded bits from the dizzy and off we go.
But, I've seen pretty much only one person say rpm gauge doesn't work. Was ages ago, and that it needed a tach booster. Is that still a thing? Or rather, is that a thing for obd2a? 
Just trying to suss out all the options and things I need, and what wiring needs to be done, so I'm ready to go as soon as I get the parts and time.
Friend can get me some or most of the parts I need to rebuild my oem dizzy. Current ebay one probably won't be as good for signal no doubt lmao.

[Adamw]

If your car has a high level tacho that was originally connected to the ignition coil primary then it likely won’t work connected directly to the ecu.   A tacho booster is generally the easiest fix if your tacho is a high level type.

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

17 hours ago, Adamw said:

If your car has a high level tacho that was originally connected to the ignition coil primary then it likely won’t work connected directly to the ecu.   A tacho booster is generally the easiest fix if your tacho is a high level type.

Having a look around, found another one with an ek and similar looking scenario. Looks like it is high level, so booster it is.

Cheers for your help as per usual, always got the goods. Both now and in the past haha

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

On 4/3/2021 at 5:05 AM, Adamw said:

If your car has a high level tacho that was originally connected to the ignition coil primary then it likely won’t work connected directly to the ecu.   A tacho booster is generally the easiest fix if your tacho is a high level type.

Sorry to bump so late, just wanting to check my wiring with the new setup.

So, I've opted for a boost controller, an ethanol content sensor and cop. And a wideband obviously.

So, to make sure I have it right there.
I can use ign 5-8 for the signal of the CoP, save cutting original harness.
I can then use a relay from the battery (or otherwise just ignition switched power from somewhere) for the power. Then just ground.

Then for boost solenoid and ethanol content, I would use analogue volt wires for inputs? and same deal for power and ground

Then for wideband, use can2, and the white connector to dtm adaptor, then power and ground as per the others.

Nothing special I'm missing there I assume? Don't need to run specifically off ign1-4 for cop?

If that's all gucci, I'll get the wiring going asap. Bought a whole bunch of dtm plugs and tools finally, so should be able to get some neat dtm connections happening. Hopefully make it all quick connect, and not messy af

[Adamw]

You need to use ign 1-4 for the coil signals.  The 12V should be from a source capable of ~15A.  Ground needs to go to the cyl head.

Boost solenoid needs to be connected to an aux output, ethanol sensor needs to be connected to a DI.  

If you have a wideband capable of CAN bus comms, then yes you can connect to CAN 1 or 2 using a CANJST cable.    

 

[Sir Alfred of Hors III]

1 hour ago, Adamw said:

You need to use ign 1-4 for the coil signals.  The 12V should be from a source capable of ~15A.  Ground needs to go to the cyl head.

Boost solenoid needs to be connected to an aux output, ethanol sensor needs to be connected to a DI.  

If you have a wideband capable of CAN bus comms, then yes you can connect to CAN 1 or 2 using a CANJST cable.    

 

Alright, need a few more bits then for cop haha.

Thanks for that. Will get the other bits started and the cop once the pins arrive.

 

Think that should cover all my bases now haha.

Thanks heaps for all your help