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NickRP

Traction control on AWD

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Can I use Fury ECU for traction control on a 4x4 vehicle? If so, are there any special aspects (incl. calibration) to consider?

Currently without traction control, there is wheelspin on all 4 wheels in 1st and 2nd gear.

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Yes of course it will be perfect for this, a basic out line is that each wheel will have a speed sensor and once calibrated 'slip' can be measured and then torque reduction applied.

You can use physical sensors or in later cars you can read the abs CAN information and use that.

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Actually, traditional wheel slip based traction control doesnt work with an AWD where all 4 wheels are spinning.  In high end motorsport they use Lidar/Radar or high speed GPS to get a more true ground speed but most of that is costly.

Maybe acceleration based launch control will be an easier option?

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2 hours ago, Adamw said:

Actually, traditional wheel slip based traction control doesnt work with an AWD where all 4 wheels are spinning.  In high end motorsport they use Lidar/Radar or high speed GPS to get a more true ground speed but most of that is costly.

Maybe acceleration based launch control will be an easier option?

Other ECU manufacturer use ROC to make a traction control. What I read it does work well. That would just need an additional axis option in a future release. 

I would like to have GPS function in the next gen Link Ecu. 

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Thanks for the replies.

Would it be possible to use high resolution GPS derived speed (available over CAN or as variable frequency) for traction control on Fury (or Thunder) ECU?

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21 hours ago, mapper said:

Other ECU manufacturer use ROC to make a traction control. What I read it does work well. That would just need an additional axis option in a future release. 

I would like to have GPS function in the next gen Link Ecu. 

You can already put acceleration on the traction and launch table axes.  Is this not what you mean?

 

19 hours ago, NickRP said:

Thanks for the replies.

Would it be possible to use high resolution GPS derived speed (available over CAN or as variable frequency) for traction control on Fury (or Thunder) ECU?

GPS is ok for high speed traction control as it is can be quite accurate when moving (provided you have very good signal), but it is very poor at low speed, standing starts etc.  Since you were originally talking about "in 1st and 2nd gear", for decent results I suspect you would need one of the high-end units that incorporate accelerometers and other physics into their speed output calculation to overcome the large lag GPS normally inherits from standing start. 

Something like this would probably give better results:  http://www.gmheng.com/speed_sensor.php

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On 2/12/2018 at 10:51 AM, Adamw said:

You can already put acceleration on the traction and launch table axes.  Is this not what you mean?

 

GPS is ok for high speed traction control as it is can be quite accurate when moving (provided you have very good signal), but it is very poor at low speed, standing starts etc.  Since you were originally talking about "in 1st and 2nd gear", for decent results I suspect you would need one of the high-end units that incorporate accelerometers and other physics into their speed output calculation to overcome the large lag GPS normally inherits from standing start. 

Something like this would probably give better results:  http://www.gmheng.com/speed_sensor.php

Hi , how can you use this speed sensor input with Thunder ecu and confiqure so you can have a speed comparisson with all 4 wheel speed sensors ? And then how can i get the ecu to trigger the traction control  based on this speed diference /slip? Is this possible o do with the Thaunder ecu? Or do i need some other external module ? Thanks in advance ! Mike.

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You would have this radar sensor connected to a DI and assigned as a wheel speed.  You would set that up as non-driven wheel speed in the speed sources menu.  You would then need at least one of the driven wheels connected to a DI and assigned as driven wheel speed.  Slip will be the difference between the Radar (road speed) and the driven wheel speed.

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17 hours ago, Adamw said:

You would have this radar sensor connected to a DI and assigned as a wheel speed.  You would set that up as non-driven wheel speed in the speed sources menu.  You would then need at least one of the driven wheels connected to a DI and assigned as driven wheel speed.  Slip will be the difference between the Radar (road speed) and the driven wheel speed.

Hi Adam , thank you  very much for your reply ! I have a couple of more questions (I am New with Link ecu) , is this sensor compatible with the speed GPi of Thunder ecu ? Please find the sensor specs below :

  • 0 to 5 V square wave, differential or single ended
  • 62.1 pulses per second for every kilometer per hour of speed measured (100 pulses per second for every mph of speed measured)

And what would be the aproximate starting calibration setting and other parameter (pull up ressistor) settings so it will read correctly the speed ?

Thanks in advance ,

Mike.

17 hours ago, Adamw said:

You would have this radar sensor connected to a DI and assigned as a wheel speed.  You would set that up as non-driven wheel speed in the speed sources menu.  You would then need at least one of the driven wheels connected to a DI and assigned as driven wheel speed.  Slip will be the difference between the Radar (road speed) and the driven wheel speed.

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12 hours ago, jmcpower said:
  • 0 to 5 V square wave, differential or single ended
  • 62.1 pulses per second for every kilometer per hour of speed measured (100 pulses per second for every mph of speed measured)

Hmm, this output is a bit higher frequency than I expected, with the thunder DI's limited to 6500Hz they will only be capable of measuring up to a max speed of about 105kmh.  You are going to need a frequency divider to make this work up to decent speed.  Something like this would be needed:  http://www.vems.com/vr-to-hall.html

Whats the cost on the radar sensor?

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