Copyninja Posted June 30, 2022 Report Share Posted June 30, 2022 Good Afternoon Gentlemen, I am having issues in finessing my afr's to stay with their target when there is a WOT gear change. See below the example Here the afrs, stay in line with the target but once if shift up from 4th WOT to 5th WOT you can see the momentary lean out before everything reaches equilibrium and afrs fall back in line with their targets. How do i fix this? Why is it happening? Also i notice my primary duty cycle hits 100% here before dropping back down. Any help with this also appreciated. I have attached my log file for this run. Kind Regads, Pat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted June 30, 2022 Report Share Posted June 30, 2022 Can you attach the tune. It appears the leanest spike occurs just as the secondaries come in so it is possibly the accel fuel/Accel time in the staged injection settings. But since those primaries are being maxed out quite away before the secondaries are being commanded you might have to look at some changes to the general staging also. Can you tell us injector sizes too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 1, 2022 850cc Primary injectors. These are the oem one's. 1500cc ASNU secondary injectors. Thank you for helping with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete_89t2 Posted July 2, 2022 Report Share Posted July 2, 2022 OP - Looks like you need to upgrade your primary FI's if they are hitting 100% duty cycle trying to reach your target AFRs. Adam's suggestion to adjust staging will help, but if you're hitting 100% DC at only 8psi MGP, you really need more fuel. You really should size the FI's big enough so that they never have to go much beyond 85% duty cycle as a safety margin. Sounds like the Injector Dynamics ID-1050's would be perfect for your FD, though you'll need to change out the fuel rails for them to fit (ID's are top feed injectors, the stock FD injectors are side feed). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 3, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2022 I think the issue is likely something i've missed with the injector staging data in regards to a smooth transition from primaries to secondaries coming online. Once they reach equilibrium at 12psi both primary and secondary injectors are below 60%dc. I suspect the issue has to be with the staging and not the size of the primary injectors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 3, 2022 Report Share Posted July 3, 2022 Accel enrichment is adding 60% to the primary since you just stabbed the throttle. So we can probably drop the accel clamp at higher rpm to prevent that from "stealing" too much available DC. I made a few small changes in your map below. Do another log with this. amendedmap3.7.2022.pclr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 3, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2022 thank you, i'll log some data. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 5, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 I cant seem to attached the log file as its bigger than 4.31mb Any way i can cut the log file? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 5, 2022 Report Share Posted July 5, 2022 upload it to google drive, onedrive or similar and share a link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 6, 2022 The drive feels much smoother now. I have made some changes to the accel clamp to try to reduce the rich spike between gear changes from 4th to 5th but there still seems to be a lot richness there which is driving the primaries to almost 100%dc. Is this related to the accel fuel or accel time? I've tried to reduce the accel clamp load from 30 to 25 but that made no real difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 6, 2022 Report Share Posted July 6, 2022 Try this one. amendedmap7.7.2022.pclr Copyninja 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 10, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2022 better than before but still seems to be dumping a lot of fuel between gear changes maxing out primary dc. Perhaps the secondaries need to come in a bit earlier/higher initial percentage? or accel clamp reduced even further? Also as i stab to WOT there always seems to be this immediate lean spike followed by a lot of richness in the afrs before reaching equilibrium. Im guessing this linked to the accel clamp table? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 12, 2022 Report Share Posted July 12, 2022 Can you drop the Sec PW lockout down to 0.8 Copyninja 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 16, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2022 Its made an improvement but for some reason a wot shift does keep maxxing out the primary dc momentarily until the secondaries come online and then once it reaches equilibrium it's all under control. Does the link g4+ have another fuel table to which I can add additional fuel over a certain driven wheel speed at all? for eg additional 3% fuel over 200kph over the main fuel table Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Im thinking in your case it might be worth trying the staging table based on RPM rather than MAP. Bringing them in at say 4-5000RPM will probably fix that 100%DC on the primary. To add extra fuel based on speed use a 4D fuel table something like below: Copyninja 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 18, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 Wont allow me to change the load to rpm on the secondary injection staging table. I'll play around with it bring the secondaries in earlier. Thank you for pointing out the above. Thats seems extremely useful the keep the fd alive at higher speeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted July 19, 2022 Report Share Posted July 19, 2022 4 hours ago, Copyninja said: Wont allow me to change the load to rpm on the secondary injection staging table. Copyninja 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted July 19, 2022 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2022 I was trying to right click directly on this table to change the load axis. I'll try this and report back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted September 3, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2022 I made the above changes and the primary injectors no longer hit 100% duty cycle. However, i've run into another issue. Everytime the secondaries come online based on the rpm the primaries seem to be make the afrs too rich and then too lean for a short duration before both primaries and secondaries hit equilibrium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted October 22, 2022 Author Report Share Posted October 22, 2022 Having issues with the secondaries coming online when load is based on rpm. It goes very rich while the secondaries come online which feels like quite a big hesitation. Is there a work around in the link g4+ software for this issue please where it doesnt do this? no matter what i do to this table....when the secondaries come online...the afrs shoot mega rich for some reason before settling. The staging process between the primaries and secondaries does not seem seemless! is this a glitch in the link g4+ software? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 22, 2022 Report Share Posted October 22, 2022 The first rich spike I have marked in pink is caused by the spike in primary PW which is coming from the main accel enrichment. The 2nd rich spike as the secondaries come in is caused by the spike in primary PW due to the staged injection accel fuel. Reduce the staged inj accel fuel% should get that better. Copyninja 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted October 23, 2022 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2022 Just to clarify is this how you control the 2nd rich spike i.e. the spike in primary pw due to the staged injection accel fuel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 24, 2022 Report Share Posted October 24, 2022 Yes, accel fuel is how much extra fuel is added to the primaries when the sec come in, and the accel time is how long that enrichment is sustained for. Copyninja and Pete_89t2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Copyninja Posted October 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2022 thank you. That is very helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete_89t2 Posted October 27, 2022 Report Share Posted October 27, 2022 Adam, Related to the OP's questions, is there a recommended approach for adjusting the staged injection Accel Fuel & Accel time parameters? I too have been struggling to get my FD to stage the injectors in as smoothly as I'd like - mine typically trend way too rich at the initial staging point, which I figure means I should be reducing the accel fuel and/or time, but is there a preferred approach as to which parameter to tweak first? What should I be looking for in the logs to inform me which change (in accel fuel or time) would be more appropriate? I don't have the luxury of a dyno to work on, so I'm trying to make my road tuning iterations as productive as possible. Thanks, Pete SchuKingR 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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