iksecz Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Hello, this is my first post on the forum. My name is Adam, I come from Poland, so everything you will read has been translated by Google. I have a small problem with the engine or ECU. The car is a BMW E36 m50tub -> m52 MS41 engine harness. When learning how to tune, I connected to the standard engine wiring harness. The problem is that when checking the ignition timing with a strobe lamp with the engine turned off, everything is OK (timing set to -323). After starting the engine, the ignition angle is about 3 teeth forward (+/-18 degrees) and it burns to the left of TDC, just to be clear. What did I check? Top dead center is correct. After setting the camshafts, I turned the crankshaft twice and everything was set correctly. The timing belt is used (if it matters) About the engine; M50b20 stroke up to 2.5L (TDS shaft) CR 8.5 Fuel 98 Compression is the same on all cylinders Pulley 60-2 (m50tu/m52single vanos) Standard Bosch coils 0221504410 BKR7E candles 0.7mm The camshaft sensor was replaced with a sensor from the m52tu engine I will add that the engine with the factory ECU + Ecumaster det3 in Implant fuel mode works normally and has been working for over 2 years with a 1.4 Bar boost. I noticed that the PcLink program, when connected to the ECU, runs much slower, when I turn the ignition on and off the program hangs. LinkEcu suggests that it may be the coils' fault. I think that if it's the coils' fault, they may also cause interference related to the floating ignition angle. I still suspect that the crankshaft position sensor is slowly dying and that's why it's behaving like this. actualmap.pclr Trigger Scope Log 2023-10-2 3;54;15 pm.llg loG5.10.llg DSC_1734.jpg.heic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 6, 2023 Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 Those coils are "dumb coils", they do not have an internal driver. The ignition drives on the Thunder are only low current signals for triggering "smart coils" (integrated driver inside the coil) or dumb coils using an external driver. They cant drive a high current dumb coil directly. Without an ignitor you will have a very weak spark and because the signal is inverted. the spark will occur at the beginning of the dwell period instead of the correct crank angle so you will observe it will drift hugely with RPM and voltage. You will either need to fit external ignition drivers such as two bosch 0 227 100 203, or change the ignition coils to smart coils. The common VW/Audi "R8" coils fit the M50 quite well and are relatively cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iksecz Posted October 6, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 Are the coils from the new BMW Eldor 12138643360 intelligent? Can the software go crazy because of these coils? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 6, 2023 Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 The 12138643360 coils are also dumb coils. In fact nearly all BMW's have dumb coils. 1 hour ago, iksecz said: Can the software go crazy because of these coils? I think it is quite likely due to having no ignitor between the ecu and coil. With no ignitor, every time the coil sparks you will get a high voltage (~100-400V) flyback sent back into the ecu. Usually the ignitor arrests this high voltage so it doesnt disturb the ecu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iksecz Posted October 6, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 Do you know the diagram of connecting the coils from Vag to Thunder? from what I can see, they have a plug with 4 wires. does it need any resistor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dx4picco Posted October 6, 2023 Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 6, 2023 Report Share Posted October 6, 2023 To make it clear, no resistor needed, connect direct to ecu ign output. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iksecz Posted October 11, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2023 The coils were successfully connected. The ignition angle remains the same regardless of the engine speed However, the program works the same as before, the worst is when trying to connect. For example, I turn on the ignition, connect to the ECU, start the engine, and the entire program freezes for 10 seconds. When I use the program without connection to the ECU, everything runs very quickly and smoothly. My laptop specifications: Lenovo ideapad s540-15iwl Intel Core i5-8265U (integrated graphics) 8GB Ram Resolution 1920 x 1080 256GB SSD drive USB 3.1 How does it work for you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamw Posted October 11, 2023 Report Share Posted October 11, 2023 What does the connection speed and redraw rate at the top right of your screen show? These two: Can you do a short PC log with the engine running and attach here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iksecz Posted October 13, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2023 connection speed is 625k. automatic connection (settings). the connection frequency is 58hz, rarely dropping to 27hz. I can prepare a new Log as soon as possible on Tuesday, because I am not at my place of residence. Maybe I'll record a video of how it behaves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.