G4X Plug in for Z30 (etc) Wide band options

[Dad]

Hello,

Firstly I'm very green to anything tuning related, looking to buy this PnP G4x

https://www.partspluguk.co.uk/product/linkecu-jzx90link-jzx90x-1jz-gte-non-vvti/

For my 92 1JZ TT Soarer currently on an Em Blue piggy back, I don't currently have a Wide band, the last tuner used theirs for tuning then removed it after and been getting on fine for the last 3 years as is.

Ideally I'd like to be running one all the time, but the costs seem to keep adding up if I go for a link wide band gear (can, tucan display etc I'm clueless..) and I'm wondering what exactly is required for tuning if I use this G4X, plug it in, tune it with a laptop, remove, and then just run it, maybe a basic monitoring system with an old tablet or phone connection?

Any pointers helpful, please excuse my ignorance on this topic.

Thx

[Confused]

If well tuned, a wideband isn't necessary, however having one allows a few extra safety features to be enabled, such as Closed Loop Lambda, limiters if it goes too rich or lean.

The Link CAN Lambda module is one of the best in my opinion, so I'd invest in that over a different brand.

You don't need any kind of display, but again, it's a nice to have, especially a CAN based one that can show you warnings etc when the ECU detects them.

You could use an old phone/tablet with RealDash but it's not quite as "nice" as a dedicated gauge, there's the potential that the battery has gone flat between uses of the car, and you need to wait for it to power up etc before you have your display output.

 

But, basically, yes, you can "just" plug it in and tune it with a laptop and require nothing else ongoing.

[koracing]

Other wideband options: 
14point7 Spartan3 with CAN
AEM X-Series wideband with CAN 30-0310 (Don't use AEM 30-4110 please.)

Link CAN Gauge, or Canchecked MFD15 gauge or BTI gauge are all options to monitor for relatively low cost.  An old laptop for $100-200 also works if you want that floating around in the car.

To take full advantage of the data gathering and advanced fuel model the Link is capable of I would add a fuel pressure sensor (of good quality) to your list as well since the link can do fuel pressure fail-safing and monitoring if you have this added into the fuel model strategy.  Good quality would be Honeywell, AEM stainless steel pressure sensors (stay away from the brass pressure sensors), Link sensors, etc.

[Dad]

4 hours ago, koracing said:

Other wideband options: 
14point7 Spartan3 with CAN
AEM X-Series wideband with CAN 30-0310 (Don't use AEM 30-4110 please.)

Link CAN Gauge, or Canchecked MFD15 gauge or BTI gauge are all options to monitor for relatively low cost.  An old laptop for $100-200 also works if you want that floating around in the car.

To take full advantage of the data gathering and advanced fuel model the Link is capable of I would add a fuel pressure sensor (of good quality) to your list as well since the link can do fuel pressure fail-safing and monitoring if you have this added into the fuel model strategy.  Good quality would be Honeywell, AEM stainless steel pressure sensors (stay away from the brass pressure sensors), Link sensors, etc.

Thanks for these options I appreciate it!

I was looking at an AEM X series 30-300 LSU 4.9, its readily available on Ebay are these no good? Can't find a 310 from a quick browse (UK based). The 14point7 Spartan3 looks good I can get those for around £200.

Excuse my ignorance what do you mean when you say 'With Can' on the items you listed?

 

Thx

On 4/30/2023 at 9:52 AM, Confused said:

If well tuned, a wideband isn't necessary, however having one allows a few extra safety features to be enabled, such as Closed Loop Lambda, limiters if it goes too rich or lean.

The Link CAN Lambda module is one of the best in my opinion, so I'd invest in that over a different brand.

You don't need any kind of display, but again, it's a nice to have, especially a CAN based one that can show you warnings etc when the ECU detects them.

You could use an old phone/tablet with RealDash but it's not quite as "nice" as a dedicated gauge, there's the potential that the battery has gone flat between uses of the car, and you need to wait for it to power up etc before you have your display output.

 

But, basically, yes, you can "just" plug it in and tune it with a laptop and require nothing else ongoing.

I did reply to this earlier but my phone didn't post, thanks for your advice this simplifies what I need to order to get me going!

[Confused]

CAN is fully digital signal between the devices, the "old school" way is that the wideband controller will convert the digital signal it knows about, and output a "0-5v" analogue signal, which the ECU then has read as an input, and convert back to a digital signal - but what the controller thinks it's outputting and what the ECU reads doesn't necessarily match (especially with the awful AEM 30-4110) - which means that the ECU doesn't have an accurate detail of the measured lambda.

Sticking with CAN, this is a purely digital signal the whole way, so it's much more accurate. The Link CAN Lambda has two-way communication with the ECU too, and much better error reporting, which is why I recommend it - there's some things to not "cheap out" on, this is one, injectors is another, and as koracing says, fuel pressure sensor is really useful too.

[koracing]

7 hours ago, Dad said:

Thanks for these options I appreciate it!

I was looking at an AEM X series 30-300 LSU 4.9, its readily available on Ebay are these no good? Can't find a 310 from a quick browse (UK based). The 14point7 Spartan3 looks good I can get those for around £200.

Excuse my ignorance what do you mean when you say 'With Can' on the items you listed?

As @Confused said - with CAN means it can send Lambda data over CAN bus to the ecu and therefore you don't have to worry about calibration issues with the wideband signal or ground offsets or anything.

The 30-0300 is the AEM X-Series gauge type controller (the gauge is the controller) - but I personally prefer less gauges which is why I recommended the 30-0310 (inline controller).  Both work just fine in my experience, and are a bit less expensive than the Link CAN Lambda (and a little easier to come by).  

The Link does have advantages in more thorough communication between the ecu and the controller to do things like not start heating the sensor until the engine is started to help prolong sensor life, as well as error reporting to the ecu.   I personally dislike how short the wideband sensor lead is to the Link unit meaning that often the device has to be near the exhaust of the car for the wiring to reach the sensor, or at the very least inside the engine bay.  While it may be rated for that environment, it just still sort of bothers me.

[Dad]

22 hours ago, Confused said:

CAN is fully digital signal between the devices, the "old school" way is that the wideband controller will convert the digital signal it knows about, and output a "0-5v" analogue signal, which the ECU then has read as an input, and convert back to a digital signal - but what the controller thinks it's outputting and what the ECU reads doesn't necessarily match (especially with the awful AEM 30-4110) - which means that the ECU doesn't have an accurate detail of the measured lambda.

Sticking with CAN, this is a purely digital signal the whole way, so it's much more accurate. The Link CAN Lambda has two-way communication with the ECU too, and much better error reporting, which is why I recommend it - there's some things to not "cheap out" on, this is one, injectors is another, and as koracing says, fuel pressure sensor is really useful too.

Thanks for that explanation, I ended up getting a Link Can Lambda kit in the end, as you say not  worth cheaping out. I did that once before with a set of injectors and cost me an engine (nearly).

16 hours ago, koracing said:

As @Confused said - with CAN means it can send Lambda data over CAN bus to the ecu and therefore you don't have to worry about calibration issues with the wideband signal or ground offsets or anything.

The 30-0300 is the AEM X-Series gauge type controller (the gauge is the controller) - but I personally prefer less gauges which is why I recommended the 30-0310 (inline controller).  Both work just fine in my experience, and are a bit less expensive than the Link CAN Lambda (and a little easier to come by).  

The Link does have advantages in more thorough communication between the ecu and the controller to do things like not start heating the sensor until the engine is started to help prolong sensor life, as well as error reporting to the ecu.   I personally dislike how short the wideband sensor lead is to the Link unit meaning that often the device has to be near the exhaust of the car for the wiring to reach the sensor, or at the very least inside the engine bay.  While it may be rated for that environment, it just still sort of bothers me.

Yes, it makes sense and I got a Link Can as you both suggested, being designed specifically to work with the ECU its worth the extra £100~ ..

My exhaust has a bung already for a wideband from when it was last tuned, mid section, and my r154 transmission tunnel has enough space to squeeze some wires past the shifter housing so hopefully I wont have to situate it outside!

Thanks so much for your help.