Honda J35 trigger pattern

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

Hi guys. I was wondering if there was a trigger pattern that might work with a Honda J35A8 engine. I have included pics of the trigger wheels. Thanks for the help.

 

Blaine Carmena

Carmena Performance

[Simon]

That is looking quite different to any of the existing patterns the crank looks the most unique. I'm assuming its an iVtec so will have variable cam timing?

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

As far as I know it is a standard VTEC motor. I do not believe there is variable cam on it. I do not have the engine here to check. I thought the same about the crank trigger. I have never seen a pattern like that.

 

[Adamw]

How sure are you that those pictures do actually match your engine?  The reason I ask is we have a "j35 V6" trigger pattern in our bible here and it shows 12 teeth on crank and 4 teeth on cam.  I had a USA customer call me last night with a "j35 V6" and we got his running using the S2000 trigger mode (which is also 12T evenly spaced on crank). 

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

I just confirmed with my customer that those are pics he took when he removed them from the engine. I thought that maybe some of the other Honda patterns might work but they were all radically different.

 

Blaine

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

As near as I can tell the J35A5 onward used this type of crank trigger. The earlier models used the same trigger as the s2000. The components are not interchangeable.

[George McFarlane]

Hey guys did you manage to get the j35a8 working? I am just about to start a boat project with one

[Adamw]

As far as I know we have not been given any information to make a trigger mode to support it.  We will need at bare minimum a 2 channel scope capture of the crank and cam.  Preferably a 3 channel capture including #1 spark if you have a running engine.

[George McFarlane]

22 hours ago, Adamw said:

As far as I know we have not been given any information to make a trigger mode to support it.  We will need at bare minimum a 2 channel scope capture of the crank and cam.  Preferably a 3 channel capture including #1 spark if you have a running engine.

Okay. Mine isn't running yet, but when I get it close I will get a scope capture for you. Or, if I can find a running one I can play with, I will get a capture

[George McFarlane]

On 6/28/2020 at 9:01 PM, Adamw said:

As far as I know we have not been given any information to make a trigger mode to support it.  We will need at bare minimum a 2 channel scope capture of the crank and cam.  Preferably a 3 channel capture including #1 spark if you have a running engine.

Hi Adam, Do you need a running engine to get the required scope capture? The reason Im asking is my engine will be going in a jet boat project, I have an engine and factory wiring loom but it is not running yet.

[Adamw]

Engine doesnt need to be running, you could do a scope capture while cranking on the starter motor.  

 

[Kinetic Research]

Just for future refernce incase someone is looking at J35 setup.  I have a J35Z2 from the 2008 Accord, it has a 60-2 wheel on the crank, hall sensor is near the trans interface.  The J35Z2 cam pulley pattern is different - see the photo below - this runs a 3 wire Hall sensor with 3 long blocks and 2 short pattern.

I would advise looking in the service manual to determine the CKP and CMP sensor wiring and positions of sensors, the cambelt replacement procedure usually has a good representation of the pulley pattern.

 

   

[Kinetic Research]

Also have an old j32 head with the pulley as shown below - these only have 2 wire VR pickup sensors for the cam.  Don't have the block so no idea what the crank pattern was.

[Adamw]

Photos of cam wheels are no use to us, we need a scope capture from a properly assembled engine with both cam and crank (and preferably but not essential spark#1 as well) recorded together.  The phasing between the patterns of the two wheels and their relationship to TDC#1 is the important info that is missing.

[Kinetic Research]

Quite right Adam, a scope trace is required.  I posted the pictures to help demystify the code patterns for the J35 family and rule out anyone making an assumption that J35's are all the same pattern - I would imagine if you had a range of patterns to choose from a close fit could be determined by looking at the pictures.  The angle between each tooth on the cam pulley is 360/46 = 7.83 degrees so the photos can be a good filter for "sensible" pattern selection.

[ryan449]

Was this ever solved, I am currently working on a build with the same pattern. and Im having no luck

[Adamw]

What pattern does your engine have?  Blaine's one in the first post had 24-1-1 on the crank and 3 teeth on the cam, this is now supported in G4X with the J30A2 trigger mode.  The J35 I worked on had 12T on the crank and 3 on the cam, this is supported with the S2000 triggermode.  

The only unknown is what Kinetic claims to have on his with 60-2 on the crank and 5 teeth on the cam, this will probably work with one of our existing 60-2 or generic modes but as yet no one has given us scope captures.

[ryan449]

Mine is a j35z3 but has the cam crank and cam as the first post.

I’ll give the 24-1-1

[Eddy.YA4]

I have a picture of my j32a2 crank gear that is for use with reluctor sensor. If I can figure out how to post the picture 

[patmay]

also running in to the same problems i have a series 1 g4 atom trying to run a j30a4 but cannot get communication from crank trigger, 

is there a way of getting the j30a4 trigger on my ecu? also cant run the g4x software on my computer keeps saying a file is missing once installed.

thanks pat  

[Adamw]

What pattern does your engine have?  

 

8 minutes ago, patmay said:

also cant run the g4x software on my computer keeps saying a file is missing once installed.

Are you using the lastest 6.20 from our website?  The missing dll file error was fixed quite a while ago from memory.

[patmay]

24-1-1 and yes 6.20 tried downloading and reinstalling tonight with same problems ill try another computer tomorrow 

[Adamw]

You wont be able to run that pattern with a G4 ecu.  You will either have to modify both the cam and crank wheels to something that will work or upgrade to a G4X.  For the crank wheel you could grind off all teeth except leave 3 evenly spaced, and grind off all but a single tooth on the cam.  

[patmay]

So would I be right in saying set it to TDC and have a tooth on the crank wheel reading there and 3 spaced including that one, then one at TDC reading on the cam ? Or will it not matter

[Adamw]

Correct, turn the engine by hand to TDC, mark the tooth that is directly under the sensor or just moving past.  Leave this tooth 2 more evenly spaced so you have a tooth every 120degs.  On the cam it doesnt matter too much, we want a single tooth and we dont want it to occur at exactly the same time as a crank tooth - preferable half way between two crank teeth.