crank no start, now starts then dies.

[Jed_dc2]

42 minutes ago, Adamw said:

You can check the sensor voltage matches what the ecu says with a volt meter.  I dont see any clues that suggest anything is wrong with the ecu so far.  

voltage on the signal wire matches voltage on the laptop  during fuel pump test but pressure does not match the gauge.

The recommended sensor calibration was slightly different from the one I was using so I changed it and it now reads half what the gauge does so no further forward.

so you think its unlikely I damaged the ecu by connecting the 12v and 5v wires ?

[Adamw]

Assuming the sensor supply is 5V and the voltage displayed in PC link matches what a voltmeter shows, then I dont see how the ecu could make the sensor output the incorrect voltage for the applied pressure.  

[Jed_dc2]

11 minutes ago, Adamw said:

Assuming the sensor supply is 5V and the voltage displayed in PC link matches what a voltmeter shows, then I dont see how the ecu could make the sensor output the incorrect voltage for the applied pressure.  

could I have damaged the 5v supply when I connected the 12V wire or damaged anything else ?

Bottom line is my car does not run on a previously proven calibration after this happened.

[Adamw]

21 minutes ago, Jed_dc2 said:

could I have damaged the 5v supply when I connected the 12V wire or damaged anything else

Unlikely if thats all that happened, the 5V output is designed to take reverse battery and +60V load dump. But your volt meter will confirm whether the 5V output is correct or not.   

You can contact tech support if you really wish for the ecu to be inspected, but as yet I haven't seen anything in your logs or descriptions that suggests there may be anything wrong with it.  If the 5V regulator or a sensor ground etc was damaged then MAP, BAP, temps etc would all read wrong too, not just the fuel press.  Testing an ecu to find a "could be anything" issue with no suspicious IO or other clues could soak up many hours of a technicians time, which will likely be chargeable if nothing is found or if something is found that was caused by user error.  So my suggestion is to eliminate as much as you can before exploring that option.  It is a whole lot easier to find an issue when the ecu is still connected to the car, sensors and other systems that allow it to exhibit the issue.  

[Jed_dc2]

On 6/24/2023 at 12:47 PM, Adamw said:

Unlikely if thats all that happened, the 5V output is designed to take reverse battery and +60V load dump. But your volt meter will confirm whether the 5V output is correct or not.   

You can contact tech support if you really wish for the ecu to be inspected, but as yet I haven't seen anything in your logs or descriptions that suggests there may be anything wrong with it.  If the 5V regulator or a sensor ground etc was damaged then MAP, BAP, temps etc would all read wrong too, not just the fuel press.  Testing an ecu to find a "could be anything" issue with no suspicious IO or other clues could soak up many hours of a technicians time, which will likely be chargeable if nothing is found or if something is found that was caused by user error.  So my suggestion is to eliminate as much as you can before exploring that option.  It is a whole lot easier to find an issue when the ecu is still connected to the car, sensors and other systems that allow it to exhibit the issue.  

The fuel pressure sensor calibration problem has been fixed, the last 2 sensors I got were supposed to be 150psi but they calibrate to the gauge using the 300psi calibration. 

I reluctantly tried adding some fuel to the master fuel value and it did seem to start stronger then would hunt for a bit then die.

could my idle ignition control have anything to do with this ? I recently enabled it but never had problems staring before.

I have attached logs and tune from today.

Just to explain again so I am 100% clear this was a fully running and driving car tuned less than 1 month ago that now does not run and appears to need more fuel for reasons I dont understand.

I am not tuning around the problem with a new master fuel value as a long term solution as that is absurd in my opinion. 

 

[Adamw]

There is something up with your MAP sensor also, it takes 2 seconds to creep back to atmosphere after the engine has stopped. 

[Jed_dc2]

10 hours ago, Adamw said:

There is something up with your MAP sensor also, it takes 2 seconds to creep back to atmosphere after the engine has stopped. 

would that suggest something is wrong with the map sensor then ? it was brand new from speedfactory racing less than a week ago and done zero miles since.

Edit

Yes the brand new map sensor was at fault I changed to a different 4 bar sensor I had and car seems to start and run on old master fuel value.

[Jed_dc2]

Drove to work this morning and was it idling at 17AFR had to add another 15% to the master fuel value.

Even still was going lean and closed loop corrections are all over the place compared to logs from a couple weeks ago.

2206.llgx 2606 drive home.llgx

[Slim47]

I am sure that you have a problem with tuning and / and assembling the car and not the ECU. 

At least you can see that the fuel supply looks very strange. Your rail pressure is not calibrated, it does not have normal absolute values nor does it have a stable differential pressure. I don't think it's possible to adjust it with such fuel system operation.

When you achieve 300 kPa differential pressure under any load with a spread of 10-20 kPa, then you can talk about something.

It is clear that in the current situation, the ECU will supply the wrong amount of fuel. Even if you completely reconfigure the fuel table for current pressure surges, all this will “float away” with the first wind

[Jed_dc2]

2 hours ago, Slim47 said:

I am sure that you have a problem with tuning and / and assembling the car and not the ECU. 

At least you can see that the fuel supply looks very strange. Your rail pressure is not calibrated, it does not have normal absolute values nor does it have a stable differential pressure. I don't think it's possible to adjust it with such fuel system operation.

When you achieve 300 kPa differential pressure under any load with a spread of 10-20 kPa, then you can talk about something.

It is clear that in the current situation, the ECU will supply the wrong amount of fuel. Even if you completely reconfigure the fuel table for current pressure surges, all this will “float away” with the first wind

It was fully tuned very recently and was running and driving great, fuel pressure was set checked and set same as it always has been at the weekend.

I will double check vaccum line to regulator.

Edit.

Vaccum line is good 

Edit 2.

Could a dying or faulty fuel pump be causing what you called a strange fuel supply ?

looking at older logs the fuel pressure and differential pressure look different from todays log.

I can only apologise for jumping to conclusions about ecu this very much felt like an ecu problem based on passed experience  but looking at logs I do agree differential fuel pressure does not look right compared to when it was running good.

The differential fuel pressure is much more flat and consistent in the older logs like from the dyno earlier in the thread.

[Pete_89t2]

1 hour ago, Jed_dc2 said:

It was fully tuned very recently and was running and driving great, fuel pressure was set checked and set same as it always has been at the weekend.

I will double check vaccum line to regulator.

Edit.

Vaccum line is good 

Edit 2.

Could a dying or faulty fuel pump be causing what you called a strange fuel supply ?

looking at older logs the fuel pressure and differential pressure look different from todays log.

I can only apologise for jumping to conclusions about ecu this very much felt like an ecu problem based on passed experience  but looking at logs I do agree differential fuel pressure does not look right compared to when it was running good.

The differential fuel pressure is much more flat and consistent in the older logs like from the dyno earlier in the thread.

^Absolutely. Could be a faulty fuel pump, wiring associated with the pump, fuel pressure regulator, clogged fuel filter or anything else applicable to your fuel system that could impact fuel pressure. Your differential fuel pressure should be relatively flat & constant - no crazy swings far from your base fuel pressure setting

[Jed_dc2]

1 hour ago, Pete_89t2 said:

^Absolutely. Could be a faulty fuel pump, wiring associated with the pump, fuel pressure regulator, clogged fuel filter or anything else applicable to your fuel system that could impact fuel pressure. Your differential fuel pressure should be relatively flat & constant - no crazy swings far from your base fuel pressure setting

Ok thanks, I have something to go off now.

Its all a couple thousand miles old and branded stuff AEM reg DW300 pump will give it a check over.

[Slim47]

11 hours ago, Jed_dc2 said:

Ok thanks, I have something to go off now.

Its all a couple thousand miles old and branded stuff AEM reg DW300 pump will give it a check over.

In addition to the fuel pump, you can inspect that your fuel line is not clogged anywhere, from the filter on the pump to the diaphragm in the regulator.

I don't think this is your case, but I've experienced similar fuel system behavior when I "melted" a sponge in a Radium (FIA) fuel tank with racing fuel. Sponge was everywhere

[Adamw]

It still looks like just a calibration with your fuel pressure to me.  Regardless of which log I check and at what load I check your data returns a repeatable sensor slope of about 225kpa/V.  That doesnt quite fit the commonly available sensor ranges  - a 100psi sensor for example would be about 172kpa/V or a 150psi sensor would be ~259kpa/V.  It seems to be quite repeatable suggesting the mechanical system is working correctly. There would be some error due to regulator gradient and transient delays so I would say it is most likely a 150Psi or 1000Kpa calibration.  

Here is a snip of your log with a math channel used to generate differential FP if it had a 150psi sensor calibration set (Yellow trace).  It looks far more realistic and a FP of 167kpa would fit your symptoms.  

[Jed_dc2]

4 hours ago, Adamw said:

It still looks like just a calibration with your fuel pressure to me.  Regardless of which log I check and at what load I check your data returns a repeatable sensor slope of about 225kpa/V.  That doesnt quite fit the commonly available sensor ranges  - a 100psi sensor for example would be about 172kpa/V or a 150psi sensor would be ~259kpa/V.  It seems to be quite repeatable suggesting the mechanical system is working correctly. There would be some error due to regulator gradient and transient delays so I would say it is most likely a 150Psi or 1000Kpa calibration.  

Here is a snip of your log with a math channel used to generate differential FP if it had a 150psi sensor calibration set (Yellow trace).  It looks far more realistic and a FP of 167kpa would fit your symptoms.  

I think The fuel pressure sensor I got sent is 300psi as with the 150psi calibration it read half what I set fuel pressure to on a mechanical gauge.

My dyno log is on a different sensor from yesterday just to be clear. Log and tune from yesterday is where Im at now.

I altered sensor calibration to match gauge, 300psi calibration and the values in PClink doubled.

I have always set fuel pressure by testing pump output and adjusting the regulator to 3 bar. It has always been tuned this way.

I have other logs it driving like this with CL +/-4%.

The gauge I use for setting pressure maybe gets used 3 or 4 times a year maximum but I will get another to compare.

My tune is traditional mode I did not think the ecu would be looking at the fuel pressure other than it being a parameter for logging ?

 

[koracing]

Is it possible your mechanical gauge is incorrect?

[Jed_dc2]

58 minutes ago, koracing said:

Is it possible your mechanical gauge is incorrect?

It is possible yes however I think its unlikely as its hardly been used but I have a new one on its way to me to compare.

[Adamw]

2 hours ago, koracing said:

Is it possible your mechanical gauge is incorrect

Yes this is what I was suggesting.  The data suggests the electronic sensor is outputting a voltage that is repeatable and reflects what a 150psi sensor would output.    

[Jed_dc2]

18 hours ago, Adamw said:

Yes this is what I was suggesting.  The data suggests the electronic sensor is outputting a voltage that is repeatable and reflects what a 150psi sensor would output.    

My gauge is accurate Tried another gauge today they both read 3 bar.

The only way my electronic sensor matches this is with the 300psi sensor calibration if I used 150PSI cal it shows 1.5 bar on the laptop.

Edit.

I had a look and found another 150psi Sensor that calibrates with the 150psi Cal and matches the 3 bar on the gauge again.

[Jed_dc2]

Since I last posted I have replaced the fuel pump, fuel filter, flow tested the injectors and tried a replacement ecu.

Also used multiple replacement map sensors incase one was faulty and its still not the same as it used to be.

Could I have damaged the wideband controller when I connected 12v to the 5v wire ? 

LD performance controller 12v, ground then 0-5v into ecu expansion loom 

[Adamw]

Yes that would certainly be possible, the last one of those things I saw years ago was a very DIY-level device in a 3D printed case and very basic electronics.  They look a bit more professional nowadays from the outside at least, but I have no experience with one.  

[Jed_dc2]

It wasnt the wideband controller.

After discussing with my tuner the only logical/plausible explanation we can come to is that the very first map sensor I bought was faulty/off compared to the subsequent 3 replacements I bought.

When tuned on the first one it was good but for whatever reason the next 3 are different.