Trigger error counter m50

[Nettlez]

so I got the car back from the tuner back on the 23rd but as he was finishing the car off he started to get trigger error counting and the engine would reach its 7000rpm limit at about 3000rpm, I managed to drive the car home, got a new crank sensor but still no joy, tried putting a new plug on the loom where it goes to the crank sensor but still no better, it improves if I change the filtering level from 1 to 4. Attached is a scope with the car revving at 3000rpm but the ecu thinking its hit the rpm limit and the map. The scope looks odd on trigger one some how?

 

before launch wiring.pclr

heres also a log

log with new crank plug and sensor.llg

[neil brown]

trigger 1 is backwards goes negative first as trigger 2 goes positive first correct way

[Nettlez]

yep your right, I have no idea how this has happened. could the new crank sensor be different so it switched the polarity?

this is really weird, its like all of a sudden its started reading the other edge of the trigger wheel?

[neil brown]

swap the wire around on trigger one and that will cure it

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

Maybe its too early in the morning but I disagree about the polarity. The scope shows correct. The long upward sweep is the missing tooth. If you reverse the polarity the ECU will count the missing tooth as a trigger pulse.

Looks like you could have some interference on the crank signal. You appear to have a very strong reluctor voltage. You could up your voltage threshold on trigger 1 and that will likely help. It is set fairly low in the .pclr.

[Nettlez]

Well with the wires swapped and the ignition timing adjusted the problem is gone. I'm just confused now as to why I neded to swap be wires over with a new crank sensor? It's a reluctor type sensor, are they polarity sensitive? 

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

Is the scope image from before the sensor swap? It does show correct. I cant see a replacement sensor having an alternate polarity. Polarity should not cause massive rpm spikes as it would only add 1 pulse per revolution which will upset syncing but not rpm to a great degree. RPM spikes are usually caused by interference causing the trigger to exceed the voltage threshold creating false triggers. Have a look in the runtime trigger page and see if the ecu is now registering trigger errors. Regardless I would return it to its original configuration and increase your trigger voltage threshold for trigger1 by at least a couple of volts everywhere above 2500 rpm.

Edited December 28, 2016 by blaine@carmenaperformance

[Simon]

Blaine is correct the scope shows the correct polarity for both triggers.

Is it an option to move the position of the crank or cam sensor? You have a zero crossing on the Sync very close to the zero crossing of the tooth after the gap. With a small bit of movement this will cause issues.

 

[Nettlez]

Both are fixed unfortunately. I can remember another forum member mentioning setting the cam sensor as a Hall effect rising edge? Would this have something to do with the zero crossings? The car runs fine with the crank sensor wires swapped then timing adjusted from -85 to 271? 

[Adamw]

Both are fixed unfortunately. I can remember another forum member mentioning setting the cam sensor as a Hall effect rising edge? Would this have something to do with the zero crossings? The car runs fine with the crank sensor wires swapped then timing adjusted from -85 to 271? 

With crank sensor swapped as you have now you will see massive timing drift vs RPM.  There is another post here somewhere, where another user said setting the cam to hall got around the problem. (i will see if I can find it soon). I would only do so however if you get advice from Link support that it is ok to do this and it wont void your warranty.  I dont know the internal trigger circuit inside the G4+ but with many ecu's you can fry them if you send VR voltage into a hall circuit. Another option might be to grind one side of the cam tooth a little which may offset that zero crossing enough.  Also did you try changing trigger priority? that can sometimes help.

 

Edit - added later:

Here is the post i mentioned - it looks like you where part of that discussion anyway... http://forums.linkecu.com/index.php?/topic/6280-random-high-engine-rpm-data-logging/&do=findComment&comment=45071

Perhaps Simon can comment if it is acceptable to set the trigger 2 to hall.

Edited December 28, 2016 by Adamw

[Nettlez]

Yer I have messaged that chap to see if he can shed any more light on the problem. I find it weird how it's been fine for quite a while then just now it's got a lot worse. Guess I will have to wait for Simon to see if it's ok to set it as a Hall type

[Simon]

ECU wise fine to have it set as Hall with the pullup turned off and triggering on the rising edge.

Its not really the correct solution but might be enough if there is no ability to shift the cam or crank triggers.

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

Simon, have you had a chance to look at his log? He is getting momentary RPM spikes up to 14,000 rpm. I was figuring he was getting false triggering due to voltage threshold being too low. Would sync position cause this as well?

[Nettlez]

Ok I will give it a try today :-) oh and by the way trigger priority is all ready set to trigger 1 

[Nettlez]

so I can report back that with the cam set to hall, pullup off and rising edge it works fine, have attached a sope

with it being swapped from reluctor to hall does this effect the map at all?

[Simon]

It would be worth checking the base timing is correct but other than that will be no impact to the map.

Simon, have you had a chance to look at his log? He is getting momentary RPM spikes up to 14,000 rpm. I was figuring he was getting false triggering due to voltage threshold being too low. Would sync position cause this as well?

Yes as if the Sync moves to the other side of the tooth after the gap it will think the crank has done a 360 shift and it will spike the RPM massively.

[Nettlez]

Great thanks for everyone's help 

[blaine@carmenaperformance]

It would be worth checking the base timing is correct but other than that will be no impact to the map.

Yes as if the Sync moves to the other side of the tooth after the gap it will think the crank has done a 360 shift and it will spike the RPM massively.

Good to know Simon for future troubleshooting. Glad you got it sorted Nettlez!